Defense of the Pre Trib Rapture

[Uriah]

7 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

You are wrong here, Matt 24 does not mention Lot, Only as in the days of Noah, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until Noah entered the Ark.  Status quo until he entered the Ark.  What is going on at this present time.  Eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage. Now we await the breaking away from this Status quo.  When will this happen; at the Rapture.

No Status quo when the A/C arrives, death or captivity. no Status quo when Israel is pursued.  Try to have a Christian wedding during the time of the A/C, not going to happen, no guests, no food, no drinking.

In Christ

Montana Marv

If you look closer you can see that I didn't refer to Matthew 24, but it is in Luke. That is distraction.

Maybe Jesus was wrong? No, the simple fact you're ignoring (purposely?)  is that He delivers His own on the day of the judgment from on high, not 7 yrs earlier.

[Diaste]

3 hours ago, Montana Marv said:

Show me one verse that state people were continually indwelt by the H.S. as we are promised.  Not overcome or over shadowed by the Spirit, He came for a time and left.  Christ said for His followers to Wait for this indwelling; look what happened in Acts 2.  Any O.T. comparisons?

In Christ

Montana Marv

Psalm 51:11

[Diaste]

3 hours ago, Montana Marv said:

But not the seed of Issac or Jacob (later to be called Israel)

In Christ

Montana Marv

Both are the seed of Abraham. So the inverse is true, "If you are not the seed of Abraham, you are not in Christ."

[Montana Marv]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

Psalm 51:11

Continually Indwelt, never to leave.  1 Sam 16:3 - David was anointed king over Israel and from that day on the Spirit of the Lord came upon David in Power.  The day from his anointing as King was the Spirit of the Lord with him,  The Spirit of the Lord over shadowed him.  Unless there is different terminology.  At Pentecost all were filled with the Holy Spirit.  Eph 4:30  And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of Redemption which came though Christ Jesus.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Diaste]

On 8/15/2019 at 3:05 PM, Montana Marv said:

Continually Indwelt, never to leave.  1 Sam 16:3 - David was anointed king over Israel and from that day on the Spirit of the Lord came upon David in Power.  The day from his anointing as King was the Spirit of the Lord with him,  The Spirit of the Lord over shadowed him.  Unless there is different terminology.  At Pentecost all were filled with the Holy Spirit.  Eph 4:30  And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of Redemption which came though Christ Jesus.

In Christ

Montana Marv

It's something you'll see when the time is right. I hope in the Lord you receive all things.

 

[seeking the lost]

On 8/13/2019 at 12:22 PM, Montana Marv said:

Multiple Resurrection s for the Just. Multiple for the Unjust. The Just go into the First, the Unjust go into the Second.  It's not sequence, it's position.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Greetings Montana Marv

You do understand the danger of adding to the text, don't you?  There are only two resurrections.  They are very well defined and not spread out over time.  Those who participate in each are clearly defined.  

[Kristin]

One angle that has struck me, now this is maybe more resurrection, but I believe the main harvest is the rapture. Forgive me on this post my lack of references because I’m on a phone. The firstfruits was Jesus. But then we read that shortly after His resurrection many believers were seen in Jerusalem bodily come out of their graves. This is part of the harvest. I believe the Bible shows us Jesus resurrected a sheath? Sheaf? Like a bundle of people. They are the beginning of the first resurrection. They are the only resurrected bodies in heaven today. Next will be the main harvest. I believe is the Body of Christ. The mainly gentile believers in the age of grace. The majority of resurrected. We are the ones who marry him and are probably part of his tribulation army on white horses with angels! Still part of the first resurrection. Lastly, but still part of the first resurrection is the Old Testament saints and the tribulation saints. They are the corners and gleanings. They are the wedding guests. The main harvest, which is the Body of Christ, is the Bride of Christ. We will wed. That’s my take. All the resurrected will rule and reign in the 1000 year reign of Christ on Earth. Jerusalem will be our home and headquarters, and flesh and blood people will repopulate the earth for 1000 years. Utopia you might say. This is how I understand it after a lifetime of study. I’m open to criticism even if I don’t respond ??❤️

[Kristin]

PS. The main harvest gets raptured before the tribulation. Of course and obviously. 

[Montana Marv]

13 hours ago, seeking the lost said:

Greetings Montana Marv

You do understand the danger of adding to the text, don't you?  There are only two resurrections.  They are very well defined and not spread out over time.  Those who participate in each are clearly defined.  

You do understand the danger of taking away from the text, don't you?  There are only Two Resurrection.  One (the First) for the Just, the next (the Second) is for the Unjust.  Yes, Christ the First Fruit into the Resurrection for the Just, Next the Bride, Followed by the 70 Week Saints, followed by the rest at the end of the Mill; which would include those born during the Mill, Those who are gathered from the 4 corners of the earth to go into the Mill, Plus all the O.T. Saints.  Now For the Resurrection for the Unjust; The A/C and False Prophet are the First Fruits to go into the Lake of Fire, next All the Unjust after the GWT Judgments.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[seeking the lost]

On 8/20/2019 at 7:16 AM, Montana Marv said:

You do understand the danger of taking away from the text, don't you?  There are only Two Resurrection.  One (the First) for the Just, the next (the Second) is for the Unjust.  Yes, Christ the First Fruit into the Resurrection for the Just, Next the Bride, Followed by the 70 Week Saints, followed by the rest at the end of the Mill; which would include those born during the Mill, Those who are gathered from the 4 corners of the earth to go into the Mill, Plus all the O.T. Saints.  Now For the Resurrection for the Unjust; The A/C and False Prophet are the First Fruits to go into the Lake of Fire, next All the Unjust after the GWT Judgments.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Yes there are only two resurrections.  The first is at the end of the tribulation and only contains the ones who have loved not their lives unto death.  These have lost their heads and now are raised to reign.  This is stated in Rev. 20 :4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God.They[a] had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.  This is not a general resurrection and it does not include all just as you may want it to.

With the exception of those who are raised at the end of the tribulation every one else is raised on the last day.  Jesus says this about those who believe in Him, John 6: 38 "For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

Also consider the words of Jesus concerning the judgement at that time, (Matthew 25:31-46) 

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink?38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

The last day resurrection is the time that all this occurs as recorded in Rev 20:

The Judgment of the Dead

11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

Those whose names are written in the book of life enter into the joy of the Lord.  They are judged by their works.  Those who are not in the book of life go to the lake of fire.  This is when the sea gives up its dead.  This is the second resurrection.