A few will enter, so why bother trying at all?

[Guest Ravippe]

7 hours ago, DustyRoad said:

Welcome to Worthy, @Ravippe. I'd like to leave you with something to think about. Who are the few?

Consider the following:

Over 7 billion humans are currently alive in this world. 7,000,000,000 human souls...

Let's quantify the quantifiers.

• All = 7,000,000,000
• Most = roughly 5,000,000,000
• Many = around 3,000,000,000
• Some = 2,000,000,000 or so
• Few = 1,000,000,000 or less
• None = 0 

According to a 2011 Pew Research survey there were a little over two billion Christians worldwide as of 2010. Therefore, we might say that some of these seven billion human souls profess Christ, yes? 

How many of those two billion are born again? That's something we can't answer since we aren't privy to the hearts and minds of over two billion human souls, Ravippe. I can tell you one thing regarding my spot among the 2,000,000,000: I thought I was saved 24 years ago but I was mistaken. I wasn't born again...

My birth in Spirit took place in June of last year. You weren't aware of that until I informed you so let's be careful with our assumptions. I hope you stick around on Worthy!

I understand the message, but not sure of the relation to the case. Yes we dont know when you became born again... but whether your born again or not.... only a few can enter. There is no assumption, god said so himself...we are not sure who a 'few' are I agree but in total jesus said a few. That's not good. So if we are to truly follow jesus we must bow and accept that we may be counted among them. Thus the acceptance of hell, if god so chooses it. It almost makes sense to live this way as a Christian at least to me anyways. But it seems most Christian's I meet always think they are going to heaven. To me that doesnt make sense because I consider it hard to get in if not nearly impossible. And I hope that when I die Jesus will be happy that I tried to humble myself not even looking up to heaven showing him how much of a sinner and evil person I am

[Marilyn C]

On 1/31/2020 at 7:33 PM, Ravippe said:

As the bible says,  Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it" (Matthew 7:13-14).

And Jesus confirms it again by saying many times that Few will enter. If Few will enter, why bother trying at all

 

Hi Ravippe,

Welcome to Worthy. Now may I put your mind at ease and tell you that Jesus was speaking to the people of Israel who lived under the Law and not many of them followed it. Thus Jesus said it was a narrow gate and few find it.

Now God`s hand of mercy is ALWAYS outstretched to those who cry out to Him for help. Just look in the Great Tribulation, there is a Great multitude that NO ONE CAN NUMBER. (Rev. 7: 9 - 17). What an amazing number of people that will be. It is a great multitude that `no one could number of all the nations.` (Rev. 7: 9)

Hope that encourages your heart as to a great merciful God.

regards, Marilyn. 

[Blood Bought 1953]

58 minutes ago, Guest Ravippe said:

I understand the message, but not sure of the relation to the case. Yes we dont know when you became born again... but whether your born again or not.... only a few can enter. There is no assumption, god said so himself...we are not sure who a 'few' are I agree but in total jesus said a few. That's not good. So if we are to truly follow jesus we must bow and accept that we may be counted among them. Thus the acceptance of hell, if god so chooses it. It almost makes sense to live this way as a Christian at least to me anyways. But it seems most Christian's I meet always think they are going to heaven. To me that doesnt make sense because I consider it hard to get in if not nearly impossible. And I hope that when I die Jesus will be happy that I tried to humble myself not even looking up to heaven showing him how much of a sinner and evil person I am

 

If you see yourself as a sinner who needs a Savior......you are half-way home and waaaay farther  ahead than most of the people “ of the World” ,  and you  are ahead of multitudes Of so- called Christians that never even entered Christianity’s Starting Gate.....a Contrite Heart That only the Holy Spirit can provide.You see the “ need” for a Savior— now all you have to  do to get saved is to cry out for Jesus the Savior to show you mercy and Save you and He will!  “ ALL that ask for Mercy shall receive it”.      “ Anybody that asks to be saved will be saved”. I think things are going to work out fine for you......you will be in my prayers ...

[Guest Ravippe]

2 hours ago, Godismyloveforever said:

Why are you now called guest?

Because I was trying to type my name on the reply button and didnt look 

[Heybro]

Let me see if I can help you here. There is nothing good in any one of us, we can't earn our salvation, it's a free gift.  What Jesus requires of us is to FOLLOW HIM. When we give Him our hearts, at the point of repentance from sin (our past life) we are made complete in Him, He took ALL our sin upon Him at the cross, at which point we have been/ set free. It is now our obligation to follow His example and live our lives in the manner in which He showed us how we should then live. It was a "finished" work He completed on that cross, if you want to be "one of the few" best you get on board and with a humble and contrite heart, have love enough of what it took for Him to redeem you from that guilt and shame of living a sinful life. If, though, you choose to not rake Him at His Word, and sit on the salvation, which is now yours, as a believer, but not a follower, you may well be counted as 1 in the other camp. Look at any number of the parables, the 10 virgins, the 5 minas, Matthew 24: 40-53. Matthew 25, the chapter. Maybe after reading these portions, it will give you more understanding, hoping this helps, and, by the way, welcome to WCF Ravippe, God bless.

[Justin Adams]

4 hours ago, Guest RAVIPPE said:

I can almost start to follow the free gift thing... but at the same time, you have to follow the commandments also. So there is a catch. A person who just accepts the gift with a heart of evil should be able to enter heaven because the gift has NO conditions .its given freely. But that cant be true, and evil person in his heart can just enter because he was given the key..... at least that's how I see it. How does that part work ? Kip

a) Yeshua saves to the uttermost those that BELIEVE in Him.

b) Feel unworthy or cannot follow the many man-imposed rules and think you are lost..?  SEE 'a' above.

[Justin Adams]

4 hours ago, Guest RAVIPPE said:

Justin: I do believe loyalty to jesus, but I also believe that I will go to hell because only a few can enter. I believe in both his words.

Do not confuse SANCTIFICATION with SALVATION.

Sanctification is God's lifelong work in those He saves.

Salvation is BELIEF in the Lord Yeshua/Jesus. Believe and be Loyal to the Lord. He handles the rest... He handles the sanctification bit.

[Ruth Also]

On 1/31/2020 at 3:33 AM, Ravippe said:

As the bible says,  Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it" (Matthew 7:13-14).

And Jesus confirms it again by saying many times that Few will enter. If Few will enter, why bother trying at all

ive heard testimony, near death experiences, Jesus telling and showing people hell flooded with souls.

by logic most people here will go to hell, Jesus said only a few can Enter. I’m a Christian believe in Jesus, try and fail to follow the commands ....repent , try again, but Firmly believe I will go to hell after all is said and done.

I've heard all the arguments, such as, those who follow me will have everlasting life etc..... but you cant have it that I follow him, and only a few will enter.

It usually ends in, well your not really following him, because you didn't really believe with your heart. But after a lifetime of praying, good deeds, the sin, the repenting, you are just asking for trouble, because your gonna have mistakes.... and you never really know till the end if you REALLY followed him. So you end up living this life where your always worried about what the next day will bring, and the minute of your death.

So your still in the same crappy boat as if you just didn't try. Hell is hell, maybe ill get a better place in hell? ahahh its laughable, the levels of hell, it sounds like they all suck.

Maybe ill explain it this way... You play the lottery not really expecting to win... well most of us play in that sense anyways... but we hope someday we might win. Its like buying a dream. The hard fact is, at the end of all the day, the 99% of people that put their money into it, never get a cash return worth even talking about. Everyone knows that some people just get lucky, or the few are chosen. At the end of the day it’s better you didn’t even play. And that’s 2 bucks..... that’s all.

So in comparison most of us live with an unknown weight of not knowing where we are going to end up, we pray/play the lottery (in that example) knowing that most of us, simply cant make it in..... but we keep hoping to that MAYBE we will make it by the skin of our teeth.. and how much effort do you need to put in for Jesus... it’s ALOT, and your gonna end up in hell probably anyways.

Do you see where im going with this?

WHY BOTHER TO TRY AT ALL

WHY BOTHER PLAYING THE LOTTERY AT ALL?

Your gonna lose, because of probability with the lottery example.

Your gonna lose with Jesus, because he said himself. Only a few are chosen.

And you cant have it both ways, you CANT say that a few will enter, and THOSE who believe in me will have everlasting life. YOU CANT.

Because EVERYONE wants or tries to believe, its human nature to want to love an all powerful god, and to feel safe and secure.

i would like to hear a compelling, response. Not a lot of quotes or , help advice. Please  Argue how a loving , caring god can create a wealth of people , knowing that only a few will join him and the rest will burn in hell forever.

i thought about the choice thing...that argument doesn’t compel me or make sense because we can choose to follow Jesus , but that’s not enough , most of us still won’t make it. So try not to say , everyone has a choice... well that doesn’t work for the guy who thought they were doing good, has a heart attack, realized they never repented of sin number 2799....goes to hell and can’t repent. It’s better for him not to have even been born, or to have tried at all, because he ended up in the same place.

 

Good morning, Ravippe,  

You've asked a really astute question.  I haven't read through the other answers but here's what comes to mind when I consider your post.

What you've asked boils down to the normal and natural what's-in-it-for-me that humans ask.  No criticism there, just a normal thing.  Your brain, like all our brains, was designed by God to consider and conclude.  So it doesn't come down to the masses, it comes down to you as an individual.  I'm not convinced you will get the evidence you need for a conclusion in society or in the little pieces that the churches teach.  I recommend a deep dive into the Scriptures, because that's the written evidence that we have about who God is, at least if you are considering JHWH, the God of the Bible.  So, when you read the written evidence to consider it for yourself, how do you see it?   I'll provide some thoughts on how I see it, but the bottom line is really how you see it.  I'm just offering some suggestions here that might be helpful.  

It looks to me like the bottom line with God is that He wants a relationship with us, individually.  Think Adam, Abraham, Moses.  It looks like after that, He wants a relationship with us as a community of people who all have an individual relationship with Him.  The Hebrew people and the story of the Exodus are an interesting example of this.  So God makes people with the ability to think for themselves and draw conclusions and behave accordingly, and He tells people what will work for the best outcome in normal life and what will work for the best relationship possible. 

 

It pretty much comes down to this:  what do you want more than anything, and what are you willing to do, give, or pay to secure this outcome?  It's not so much that it's up to God.  He's already given us everything needed for life and godliness if we know what can be known of God and through our knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ and how Jesus showed us the Father.  

Examples for this kind of obedience could include these:  Abraham believed God when God told him to leave his hometown.  He believed in God's mercy when he discussed his concern for Lot's family living in Sodom.  He believed God when God asked for the token of obedience that would foreshadow God's own Son becoming the sin offering for all of us once for all.  Or how about the 3 Hebrew boys in the Book of Daniel who said that while God was able to deliver them from the furnace for refusing to bow to other gods, they were going to obey whether or not God DID save them?  

The way I saw it as a late teen hearing this good news that Jesus died for my sins - this is too big a deal to trust anyone's words on the matter.  If this is real, God will be found if you seek Him.  What's that first commandment?  Love the Lord your God with all your heart.  If that is the goal of your life, you won't be disappointed because you will be motivated from the inside to keep seeking, keep knocking, and keep asking.  You can never exhaust this search but you can go deeper into Who God IS and more solid into what He said, and you can trust every word that He said.  It's an entirely different matter if you are actually only interested in doing things your own naturally limited way, not seeking something further and better, and  just hoping for a get-out-of-jail-free card.  I don't mean any insult here by saying that, just pointing out the evidence as I see it from studying the written words and listening to what Jesus actually said.  It does appear that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom and that God promises to draw near to the humble of heart.  

I haven't read the replies you've received so far, so I'm not directing any comments to anything that anyone else has offered.  I will note that in life there are lots of Pharisees who will want to mold you into their way of thinking, and I caution you that this is actually all up to you in the end if you want to be molded into the image of Christ in you, transformed by the renewing of your mind when you study what He says and learn how wise and wonderful God really is, how His words make sense out of life.  The first step is indeed faith, a preliminary foundation that He is and that He will reward your search, a decision on your part that you can trust HIM Who spoke everything into existence and made man in His image.  You have the Scriptures to study this for yourself and draw your own conclusions.  If you lack a Bible, let that be known.  I can't imagine any believers on this forum would not want to help you obtain one.  

It's just my perspective, I haven't sited the several scriptural concepts I've mentioned, but they are there and we really have no other secure foundation other than what God has to say about things.  I hope this helps, and I hope well for you, Ravippe.  

 

On 1/31/2020 at 3:33 AM, Ravippe said:

 

 

[Desopixi Seilynam]

What is "few" when the number of souls that have been is in the billions? Few, would therefore be at least millions of people.

My speculations and understanding concerning Hades and the lake of fire are as follows;

There are two places, Hades which exists now, it is like a vivid dream, a spiritual place, non-believers may end up there after death. And the second place is the lake of fire, a physical place, which I believe is initially kindled during the return of Christ; Rev. 19:20-21, and then fully established after the 1,000 year reign of Christ; Rev 20:10. In short, this current land sea and sky becomes the lake of fire; 2 Peter 3:10-12, Rev 21:1-2 new Jerusalem descends and those who are worthy will be able (have the ability to) enter it. Hades, a spiritual place, is thrown into the lake of fire; Rev 20:14, and the lake of fire is called; the second death. And Jesus told us "fear not him who can kill the body and can not kill the soul" Thereby we see that the lake of fire is the method by which souls/spirits die. I believe for those within, it will be similar to being in the middle of the ocean, or being crucified. One would be able to struggle to stay alive or choose to give into the fire and thereby cease to exist. And because most would rather exist than not exist, they will choose to forever struggle, and will forever weep and gnash their teeth, nevertheless grateful to exist. 

God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to the knowledge of repentance. He desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 2 Peter 3:9, 1 Timothy 2:4 

Therefore people will only perish due to their own choice, due to their own God given will.

-------

I know the following is a whole bunch of scripture, but don't read it as just scripture, or verse by verse, read it altogether, it will give a clear simple path, and therefore I leave out the references.

"Do not vex  a stranger" "I will not justify the wicked" "Love your neighbor as yourself" "Love the stranger as yourself" "Love ye therefore the stranger"

"I will raise Israel up a prophet and shall put my words ( ^ ) in his mouth, and it shall come to pass that whosoever will not hearken to him, shall be destroyed from among the people"

"Also the sons of the stranger, that hold fast to my covenant and do the things that please me, even them will I bring to my holy hill for my house shall be called a house of prayer for all people"   "Behold the days come says the Lord, that I will make a renewed covenant; this shall be the covenant, I will put my law into their minds and hearts"

The Prophet; Joshua of Nazareth; said; "Whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do you even so to them, for this is the law and the prophets"  Those who sincerely believe those words of His and have them memorized in their minds and lived out in their hearts, thereby have the law literally in their minds and hearts, and are therefore very literally under the renewed covenant.

"Therefore whoever hears these sayings of mine, and puts them into practice, is like a wise man that built his house upon the rock"

"His commands are not grievous" They have one easy summary "Love one another" If we are sincerely living by the love that Christ taught, we can rest in that, we can rest in simply following Christ, our fleshly desires, our addictions, will subside as we focus on the love that Christ taught. And more, if we believe that due to His death and resurrection, we have His Holy Spirit, we also believe that we can do all things through His Spirit that is in us.

-------

"If you through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the flesh you shall live" The general direction of the Spirit is love, sincere love that starts in the mind.

Adultery is one example of the deeds of the flesh, but one, in the mind, considering the feelings of the other persons husband or wife, and being compelled, by Christ, to love that person, is thereby steered away from the act. And so Paul writes; "holding every thought in obedience to Christ".

God is not willing that any should perish. Via the death and resurrection of Christ, all have the ability to be possessed by the Holy Spirit of God, and thereby become righteous through Spirit led practice of the teachings of Christ. "For with the heart man believes unto righteousness".

Edited February 3, 2020 by Desopixi Seilynam

[BeauJangles]

 Ravippe

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• Couldn't help but notice three pages on a newbie that left the site after only one post. I think that's it. 

Edited February 3, 2020 by BeauJangles