Book of Enoch

[Sister]

XXXIV.

God convicts the idolaters and sodomitic fornicators, and therefore brings down a deluge upon them.

THEY have rejected my commandments and my yoke, worthless seed has come up, not fearing God, and they would not bow down to me, but have begun to bow down to vain gods, and denied my unity, and have laden the whole earth with untruths, offences, abominable lecheries namely one with another, and all manner of other unclean wickednesses, which are disgusting to relate.

2 And therefore I will bring down a deluge upon the earth and will destroy all men, and the whole earth will crumble together into great darkness.

XXXV.

God leaves one righteous man of Enoch's tribe with his whole house, who did God's pleasure according to his will.

BEHOLD from their seed shall arise another generation, much afterwards, but of them many will be very insatiate.

2 He who raises that generation, shall reveal to them the books of thy handwriting, of thy fathers, to them to whom he must point out the guardianship of the world, to the faithful men and workers of my pleasure, who do not acknowledge my name in vain.

3 And they shall tell another generation, and those others having read shall be glorified thereafter, more than the first.

 

XXXVI.

God commanded Enoch to live on earth thirty days, to give instruction to his sons and to his children's children. After thirty days he was again taken on to heaven.

NOW, Enoch, I give thee the term. of thirty days to spend in thy house, and tell thy sons and all thy household, that all may hear from my face what is told them by thee, that they may read and understand, how there is no other God but me.

2 And that they may always keep my commandments, and begin to read and take in the books of thy handwriting.

3 And after thirty days I s all send my angel for thee, and he will take thee from earth and from thy sons to me.

 

XXXVII.

Here God summons an angel.

AND the Lord called up one of the older angels, terrible and menacing, and placed him

p. 95

by me, in appearance white as snow, and his hands like ice, having the appearance of great frost, and he froze my face, because I could not endure the terror of the Lord, just as it is not possible to endure a stove's fire and the sun's heat, and the frost of the air.

2 And the Lord said to me: 'Enoch, if thy face be not frozen here, no man will be able to behold thy face.'

 

XXXVIII.

Mathusal continued to have hope and to await his father Enoch at his couch day and night.

AND the Lord said to those men who first led me up: 'Let Enoch go down on to earth with you, and await him till the determined day.'

2 And they placed me by night on my couch.

3 And Mathusal expecting my coming, keeping watch by day and by night at my couch, was filled with awe when he heard my coming, and I told him, 'Let all my household come together, that I tell them everything.'

 

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[whatdoIwant2callmyself]

I think people of God should discern what God puts before them when seeking wisdom from the father.There are literally thousands of manuscripts and fragments that have been discovered after what was used to compile the canon .  And the canon was arrived at by the judgements of men , in political offices of authority over other men.

And those men asked all men for all time to believe them when they said, they as the authors of those manuscripts reviewed and judged worthy of the canon, to believe first that those autograph authors did not write what was there. But instead God told them to write what was there.

We've held faith from the first word ever inked on any papyrus, scroll, skin. And to this day we hold first to faith that what tells us God is, the Bible, is not of man.

Thousands of manuscripts, fragments, etc.... Think about that.

 

I have met Christians that do not believe anything not in the Bible is to be believed to be of God. They don't trust that God speaks to his people today in prayer, or in life. They worship instead the Bible itself and from there derive their faith in God. Going no further to enrich their walk.

In your beginning God gave you a brain.

[OneLight]

There are many books that claim to be part of, or should be part of, what we call the bible.  They were not for good reason.  I guess I would like to ask people who believe they should be why?  What guidelines were followed in selecting the 66 books and do these other books qualify?

[simplejeff]

2 hours ago, OneLight said:

There are many books that claim to be part of, or should be part of, what we call the bible.  They were not for good reason.  I guess I would like to ask people who believe they should be why?  What guidelines were followed in selecting the 66 books and do these other books qualify?

What does YHWH HIMSELF say ?  YHWH HIMSELF guards HIS WORD.  

The BIBLE and YHWH'S people are perhaps the smallest 'accepted' and [close to] least 'in number' on earth,  and are attacked by all society/ all the others,  just as Israel has been for thousands of years - and Israel is STILL HERE !

So,  why does YHWH HIMSELF guard HIS WORD ?   It is HIS GOOD PLEASURE to do so. HE IS FAITHFUL and TRUE,  even though "all men be liars".

YHWH is TRUSTWORTHY and RELIABLE.

[Sister]

7 hours ago, OneLight said:

There are many books that claim to be part of, or should be part of, what we call the bible.  They were not for good reason.  I guess I would like to ask people who believe they should be why?  What guidelines were followed in selecting the 66 books and do these other books qualify?

Hi Onelight. 

The gospels were given to the gentiles.  Our foundation is Christ and the New testament.  We cannot understand the Old Testament until we know the New testament first and see where everything was leading up to.

With some of these other books, (and I don't mean all), but many, cannot be understood by the gentiles until they first receive The New and Old Testaments, then they can compare, ....if the spirit of these books come from God.  If no foundations were first laid, then it would be confusing.  I don't think it was man's doing, but God's doing to not include these books in the cannon. He has saved that little bit of extra knowledge for those in these last days who truly seek him, a little added info.

God explained to Enoch in much detail how he created the world with all his wisdom.  How everything fits nicely together, and how there is a system that God put in place in the heavens and on the earth.  Everything is worked out, ...carefully calculated by God, and everything has a purpose.  I find it very intriguing, that the creator has let us in on a few things that science cannot in that aspect of things.

These books that Enoch wrote are not for the doubtful but for the faithful.  They don't bring salvation, because salvation has to be there first, but then again, who am I to say that?, something in there could change a scientists mind involving creation, opening up his mind to God's glory and wisdom, and change his view and heart in some way.

That's my opinion.

[Sister]

You can test or judge whether these words agree with the holy scriptures or not.

XLIV.

Enoch instructs his sons, that they revile not the face of man, small or great.

THE Lord with his hands having created man, in the likeness of his own face, the Lord made him small and great.

2 Whoever reviles the ruler's face, and abhors the Lord's face, has despised the Lord's face, and tie who vents anger on any man without injury, the Lord's great anger will cut him down, he who spits on the face of man reproachfully, will be cut down at the Lord's great judgement.

 

3 Blessed is the man who does not direct his heart with malice against any man, and helps the injured and condemned, and raises the broken down, and shall do charity to the needy, because on the day of the great judgement every weight, every measure and every makeweight will be as in the market, that is to say they are hung on scales and stand in the market, and every one shall learn his own measure, and according to his measure shall take his reward.

compare

Luke 6:38   Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.
 

Matthew 7:2   For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

 

XLV.

God shows how he does not want from men sacrifices, nor burnt-offerings, but pure and contrite hearts.

WHOEVER hastens to make offering before the Lord's face, the Lord for his part will hasten that offering by granting of his work.

2 But whoever increases his lamp before the Lord's face and make not true judgement, the Lord will not increase his treasure in the realm of the highest.

3 When the Lord demands bread, or candles, or flesh (sc. cattle), or any other sacrifice, then that is nothing; but God demands pure hearts, and with all that only tests the heart of man.

compare;

John 4:23   But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

 

 

[SimonB]

My question on subjects like this goes as follows...

Okay so a Book is mentioned in scripture by reference.

So we know it exists and that it was known at that time.

1. sometimes a book may be referred to because it is familiar to the readers of that time, it doesn't mean the book is inspired, or even that the scriptural writer thinks you should read it, but rather, because he believes the people of the time are familiar with it. So its used only to make a point.

2. the issue of identity. How do we know that a book which is now presented as "The Book of Enoch" for eg, is in fact the same one referred to in scripture. Since their is a period during which the book was "lost", how do we know its even the same one?

Apocrypha could only be useful to give a sense of life in those times. As i understand it, this is the reason for their inclusion in the early KJV, for eg.

By the way, some of them are clearly just fairy tales.

[other one]

but we should not really put them all in the same bucket either.

and just because we don't tag something as inspired doesn't mean it all false either.

[missmuffet]

We should treat the Book of Enoch (and the other books like it) in the same manner we do the other Apocryphal writings. Some of what the Apocrypha says is true and correct, but at the same time, much of it is false and historically inaccurate. If you read these books, you have to treat them as interesting but fallible historical documents, not as the inspired, authoritative Word of God.

https://www.gotquestions.org/book-of-Enoch.html

[SimonB]

Absolutely, I would never seek to group things like a demographic.

Give the generalizations unto the marketers but I would want to look at each on its own merits.

As to the second point, I agree, indeed that's why, as I mentioned, I believe they were once included between the OT and the NT.