AMERICA IS MYSTERY BABYLON

[SINNERSAVED]

2 hours ago, Reinitin said:

BTW Albert Rivera appears to be a total nut case. There are criminal allegations, denials about Him being a priest  a total smear of his character and integrity. But if you look who smeared Him its catholic supporters so who knows. people who knew him say the allegations are all fabricated he was committed to making the truth known and he knew he would die for doing it.

I brought this same conclusion back in a thread about a month and a half ago, about the same guy and what really happened with him' I believe you are correct and that,

it backs what I have concluded on my own research also , and for the record, if you keep looking  just a little harder, history ? and the real case of what is the origins, and how it all came to be from the different religions and denominations , come around full circle, and if you want to see something we can all see as it stands today,  just so , to point to what to look for, check out, why d .c ,rome, france, Russia, Egypt, saudi, turkey, and America, and the list goes on around the world,

 what do they all have in common,?

look at the capitals, and look at the buildings, all round and they all look identical, is it a fluke ? and most have the obeslisk  !!, as monuments, follow what this represents ? and what it stands for , also look at the symbols of all of these, and tell me, we don't see a similarity , so if we focus on all this, who would be the main mother of all of this, ?

 its all in the history books, if we do our home work,? there is so much to see that ties all to one, and one to all,

 there is also a saying , I offend wondered who came up with this line, ? maybe some one can tell me who says this ?...

 that all roads lead to Rome ?

Huh,,,, what does this mean ? and how does this effect religion , and the power of the world today ?and what the Bible tells us about good and evil ?

blessings and peace,  any thoughts , I am all ears ... thank you

[ARGOSY]

5 hours ago, RevelationWriter said:

- There are over 850 scriptures of the city Jerusalem most within Prophecies past, present, and future.

- There are only 9 scriptures of the city of Rome. In which none are Prophetic.

Interpretations of scripture are not revelations in scripture.

Perception is not Prophecy. 

Well the focus of the bible is on the Jews so of course there will be more prophecies about their capital city than any other city. Even regarding powerful worldly kingdoms,  Jerusalem has its place. It is highly connected to the 8th kingdom.  However there are 8 kingdoms and its not likely that all 8 are all Jerusalem. So there has to be other players involved as well. The fact that the "fourth/final  kingdom" of Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 is in fact Rome, points to the Roman connection at the end. 

[ARGOSY]

11 hours ago, BlindSeeker said:

Ok.

But you have , and so you have left me, and doubtless others as well, not the least bit persuaded of your premise; primarily because of your failure to provide significant evidence.

So, I believe you are wrong.

Now, like you, I have (and do) believe some things that I have yet to fully substantiate; so I study to seek out the truth of those issues. But when after due diligence in search of the truth I reach the point of not being able to substantiate my held-position, I embrace the things that haven’t fallen to the wayside in my research and gather up the new evidence that leads me further down whatever path it has opened up in my search for truth.

I’ve learned it is folly to just “believe” something, everyone believes something. Some believe Allah is a god and the only one, others don’t believe in a god at all, while others believe in hundreds of gods.  Me? I believe Jesus was God manifested in the flesh. Not because I choose to believe it, but because the scriptures in my research have been used by His Spirit and have proven it to me and thus I can communicate it as a truth to others as it were, line upon line, precept upon precept.

All that said, of course we are talking about kingdoms. That is obvious. However, it is also about a precise timeframe for those kingdoms, specifically that timeframe under a particular king that was responsible for bringing about the fall of that kingdom. For that timeframe (as well as the empire’s direct connection to Israel) is what makes those precise references to both a kingdom and a king relevant and worthy of our consideration and acknowledgment of each as prophetically significant.

Furthermore, this is all made clear by the angel’s referencing the seven heads as being representative of seven mountains; but the angel continues and makes a explicit reference to the “kings” as well. That obligates us as students of God’s word to rightly divide the word and consider the specific relevance of both aspects, kingdom and king. However, it is undeniable that it is the king of which it is stated “when he cometh, he must continue a short space.”

Revelation 17: 9 - And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

The mere grammar in the verse above demands the focus on the “king” part of a kingdom; and not the other way around.

So, once again I will ask you another question, how does a "king" fit into your belief of “WEST/EAST Rome." Once you answer that with a reasonably plausible answer, we can then pursue the later part of “he” continuing a "short space" to see if it is in harmony with your position.

 

 

You say that I "hardly attempted to answer my questions". You only asked 2 questions, which I completely answered. A king is symbolic for a kingdom, therefore I don't need to supply you with a king for the 7th kingdom. Also "continue for a while" can mean that kingdom is longer than the rest, not shorter than the rest, depending on which words you emphasize. I believe split Rome is longer than the other 6 kingdoms, and fits well with "continues for a while".  So both questions you asked were completely dealt with even though you clearly imply I somehow did not deal with your questions.

Now you still seem to be requiring a king for my split Roman Empire which has been in power for over 1500 years and has had many kings in both the east and the west. I see no requirment to provide you with a king. The seventh is a 7th consecutive kingdom/empire and I believe its split Rome, and each half of Rome has had multiple kings.  It is the 8th kingdom which will result in the antichrist. That will require a king,antichrist. He is as yet unidentified and 2 Thess 2 indicates his identity will only be made clear at a great revealing which co-incides with the great event of Rev 13. Only then will be be able to identify the king of the 8th kingdom. There is no specific king associated with the 7th empire. 

 

[ARGOSY]

10 hours ago, Reinitin said:

I read the testimony of Alberto Rivera, former Jesuit priest after his conversion to Protestant Christianity. As a jesuit priest he had access to many historical documents guarded at the vatican. Now I do know to save my judgment till Christ. I have fact checked some of his statements to historical records available. So far I haven't found any claim he makes about rome's geographical and political movements to be fabricated. Mohammed wife and her cousin who interpreted His visions were devout Catholics and it is a very interesting testimony to read. I think he was poisoned shortly after he exposed the information.

. 

Very interesting. I have heard rumours of the Catholic connection to the Koran, and knew of his Catholic wife, but wasn't sure of the extent.   The interesting implication of this is that the Vatican would then control Islam because at any moment they could expose it as a fraudulent Catholic religion. Obviously both parties wouldn't want that exposure and so mutual co-operation is forced on Islam.   

This also explains why the beast and the ten horns hate the prostitute.  Turkey, Iran etc turn against their EU/Papal manipulators at the end, burning Rome and the EU.   This leaves the way open for these countries to attack the ultimate manipulator, the antichrist/ISA in Jerusalem. Islamic prophecies already encourage Islam to firstly create a Jewish Messiah (Sunni Islam) and secondly attack this Jewish Messiah (Shi-ite Islam).

 

[Last Daze]

11 hours ago, other one said:

Keep in mind as you discuss, whatever comes out of the abyss, must have been put there to start with.

Agreed.

• Then he said, “Do you understand why I came to you? But I shall now return to fight against the prince of Persia; so I am going forth, and behold, the prince of Greece is about to come."  Daniel 10:20

About to come from where?  My guess is the abyss.

[WilliamL]

To review:

On 3/11/2016 at 11:37 PM, BlindSeeker said:

 One of the most important clues regarding this “eighth” is given us when the angel states that the beast “was, and is not, and yet is… even he is the eighth.”

Revelation 17:8 - The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. 9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

My original reply: If I understand your position correctly ... you are saying that America/the US is the 8th Beast.

[1] How does a country "ascend out of the abyss"?  [2] How did it get there in the first place?  [3] Are not only fallen angels ever spoken of as being there?

other one's response:

12 hours ago, other one said:

Keep in mind as you discuss, whatever comes out of the abyss, must have been put there to start with.

Blindseeker's three responses did not answer any of the three questions above. Therefore I can only reasonably presume that he has no biblical support to his teaching that America is the 8th king of Revelation 17:11.

 

[Reinitin]

5 hours ago, ARGOSY said:

Very interesting. I have heard rumours of the Catholic connection to the Koran, and knew of his Catholic wife, but wasn't sure of the extent.   The interesting implication of this is that the Vatican would then control Islam because at any moment they could expose it as a fraudulent Catholic religion. Obviously both parties wouldn't want that exposure and so mutual co-operation is forced on Islam.   

This also explains why the beast and the ten horns hate the prostitute.  Turkey, Iran etc turn against their EU/Papal manipulators at the end, burning Rome and the EU.   This leaves the way open for these countries to attack the ultimate manipulator, the antichrist/ISA in Jerusalem. Islamic prophecies already encourage Islam to firstly create a Jewish Messiah (Sunni Islam) and secondly attack this Jewish Messiah (Shi-ite Islam).

 

According to Rivera the idea was to use the tribes to get back control of Jerusalem, create a destroyer of the jews and destroy true christians without their destruction being directly related to the vatican. There were some other deals that had to do with mecca and some other pursuits involved. If you read his testimony they accomplished most of their goals then they lost control of Islam. It goes into a lot of stuff like they named a city after mohammed's daughter and they honored her like mary to reconnect with Islam the kindred spirits. They created sightings of Mary with Mohammed's daughter for political advancements in areas, lot of land trades etc. 

[Reinitin]

http://www.ligonier.org/blog/seven-kings-revelation-17/

A little history to study with...

[other one]

4 hours ago, Last Daze said:

Agreed.

• Then he said, “Do you understand why I came to you? But I shall now return to fight against the prince of Persia; so I am going forth, and behold, the prince of Greece is about to come."  Daniel 10:20

About to come from where?  My guess is the abyss.

The only things that I have read coming from the abyss are the 200 angels that made whoppie with Adams daughters, and Possibly Azazel. 

 

The princes of Persia and Greece have been here since the flood....   but you have to get outside the Bible to understand that.   Those princes were put in thier positions when the Tower of Babel was stopped and those who were supposed to be overseeing each of the groups turned to follow Satan....  and the whole world has been a mess ever sense.

We are living an object lesson showing everything decent out there even beyond the universe what happens when you let Satan and his rebellion run it's course......  

 

and that's the story of the world according to Sam...

[other one]

3 hours ago, WilliamL said:

To review:

My original reply: If I understand your position correctly ... you are saying that America/the US is the 8th Beast.

[1] How does a country "ascend out of the abyss"?  [2] How did it get there in the first place?  [3] Are not only fallen angels ever spoken of as being there?

other one's response:

Blindseeker's three responses did not answer any of the three questions above. Therefore I can only reasonably presume that he has no biblical support to his teaching that America is the 8th king of Revelation 17:11.

 

I would actually suggest you read his boook.......     the subject is really kind of complicated and i don't have the time nor the inclination to defend it.

but I can tell you that the book is not a waste of time to read.   It's not easy reading for it is compacted with details that can be kind of hard for a simple mind like mine to keep up with.....   had to make notes and read it twice.