OneLight Posted May 3, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.24 Reputation: 9,760 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted May 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Fidei Defensor said: My point was God made the sea, and the person I was responding to said a theory was the Flood created the oceans, but actually God made the sea before the Flood. It ties to Revelation, because God decides not to make a New Ocean and Sea, but removes it. I agree with another member that what awaits us in New Earth and New Jerusalem is greater than this world (Revealtion 21:1-53) and I argue that presence of Jesus and His love will be so encompassing that we won't notice anything missing, and there could be something better I've missed in Revelation. Thanks you for your explanation. I was confused as to how you were tying this together. Since this thread is better suited for eschatology, I am moving it there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted May 3, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 3, 2017 1 minute ago, OneLight said: Thanks you for your explanation. I was confused as to how you were tying this together. Since this thread is better suited for eschatology, I am moving it there. That is probably a better place for it, since we discussing the End of the Ocean and the End of Days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Yowm said: Jesus walked through walls in His resurrected body so who knows what restrictions, design or unrestrictions we will encounter? Indeed. I actually have been to heaven in what Paul describes as the Third Heaven, "I must go on boasting. Though there is nothing to be gained by it, I will go on to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2 I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven—whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows. 3 And I know that this man was caught up into paradise—whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows— 4 and he heard things that cannot be told, which man may not utter." (2 Corinthians 12:1-4). I can tell you, that the paintings, movies, and ideas people have are but shadows and glass dimly, "Now we see things imperfectly, like puzzling reflections in a mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity. All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God now knows me completely." (1 Corinthians 13:12). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 27 minutes ago, Fidei Defensor said: My apologies for making it appear as your theory. That is a very interesting point, because the continents do look like they could connect like jigsaw puzzle and the Flood (which is recorded in all annuls of human history, even Chinese have it in their history) would be great explanation. It makes me wonder, if in Revelation the Lord abolishes and dissolves the Ocean, is this Him keeping his word to zenith, "establish my covenant with you: Never again will all life be destroyed by the waters of a flood; never again will there be a flood to destroy the earth." (Genesis 9:11). Not that the Lord would need to flood anything in New Earth, with everyone being His followers and Saints. Just a thought, not doctrine I am exposing. No need to apologize my friend, after all, I was the one who brought it into the conversation. Personally I hold to the literal reading in that there is no sea, but I am always open to the possibility of being wrong about a great number of things. God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, wingnut- said: No need to apologize my friend, after all, I was the one who brought it into the conversation. Personally I hold to the literal reading in that there is no sea, but I am always open to the possibility of being wrong about a great number of things. God bless I think there is no literal sea either. The only other possibility is the tense of word is temporary, "there was no more sea," as in continuing a sentence "the heavens and earth passed way, the sea passed away too," oppose to this being an absolute statement that "the sea no longer existed, and will never exist again." Its hard to tell by the general consensus of Bible translations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,833 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,756 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Online Share Posted May 4, 2017 11 hours ago, Fidei Defensor said: I was reading Revelation and it says there will be no more sea/ocean, "Then I saw "a new heaven and a new earth," for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea." (Revelation 21:1). We are told there will be a river in middle of the New Jerusalem (Revelation 22:1), although that could be allegorical. What are your feelings on there being no more ocean? I cannot be mad at Lord, He knows why, and for those who suffer from Thalassophobia and Aquaphobia, this will be a relief. Some translations indicate that sea is just passing away like other parts of earth being destroyed by God's fire for renewal, "Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and there is no longer any sea," but other translations are adamentg that the sea no longer exists, "Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea no longer existed." There a number of issues raised with this post. The way I see it, is symbolic. One of them is as in " the trees will clap their hands", and others as "the sun will turn into darkness,and no light or heat will come from it" and the moon will turn into blood", and what about this one "the stars will loose their light and fall on the earth just figured this one out", And this one it is from JESUS , the earth will change, just the way when we put on a new garment . And the Scriptures do not say "OCEAN", and that time this world "OCEAN", was known to people and to the author or the Angels, and to JESUS CHRIST. But there is a reason why they use the word "SEA" and not "OCEAN". To use the word OCEAN, it could referred to a literal meaning, but to use the word "sea", as in others references, it's been use for a symbolic meaning. Where sea is referring to a place that holds the people, and where before JESUS CHRIST, all the people went, and not because of their own fault , but because their was not any other place. Like in "where Babylon the great was cast into the SEA. What would that mean, that Babylon now can be found in the SEA, or can be found not in the old location, but in its new location in the SEA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 14 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: There a number of issues raised with this post. The way I see it, is symbolic. One of them is as in " the trees will clap their hands", and others as "the sun will turn into darkness,and no light or heat will come from it" and the moon will turn into blood", and what about this one "the stars will loose their light and fall on the earth just figured this one out", And this one it is from JESUS , the earth will change, just the way when we put on a new garment . And the Scriptures do not say "OCEAN", and that time this world "OCEAN", was known to people and to the author or the Angels, and to JESUS CHRIST. But there is a reason why they use the word "SEA" and not "OCEAN". To use the word OCEAN, it could referred to a literal meaning, but to use the word "sea", as in others references, it's been use for a symbolic meaning. Where sea is referring to a place that holds the people, and where before JESUS CHRIST, all the people went, and not because of their own fault , but because their was not any other place. Like in "where Babylon the great was cast into the SEA. What would that mean, that Babylon now can be found in the SEA, or can be found not in the old location, but in its new location in the SEA. Technically, the word ocean doesn't appear anywhere in the bible, it is always referred to as sea, from Genesis to Revelation. Genesis 1:9 Then God said, “Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together into one place, and let the dry land appear”; and it was so. 10 And God called the dry land Earth, and the gathering together of the waters He called Seas. And God saw that it was good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 266 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,196 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,494 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted May 4, 2017 11 hours ago, Fidei Defensor said: I was reading Revelation and it says there will be no more sea/ocean, "Then I saw "a new heaven and a new earth," for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea." (Revelation 21:1). We are told there will be a river in middle of the New Jerusalem (Revelation 22:1), although that could be allegorical. What are your feelings on there being no more ocean? I cannot be mad at Lord, He knows why, and for those who suffer from Thalassophobia and Aquaphobia, this will be a relief. Some translations indicate that sea is just passing away like other parts of earth being destroyed by God's fire for renewal, "Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and there is no longer any sea," but other translations are adamentg that the sea no longer exists, "Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea no longer existed." Hi Fidei Defensor, Haven`t talked to you before, but have read some of your comments on different threads. Pleased to meet you. Now that is an interesting topic. God has written it in His word and thus should be considered. My personal thoughts are - the sea helps to purify the atmosphere, I think, (not being very scientific) and in the New Heavens and New Earth the `rays` of the New Jerusalem will perform this function. Just a thought, Marilyn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 21:1-8 The new heaven and the new earth will not be separate from each other; the earth of the saints, their glorified, bodies, will be heavenly. The old world, with all its troubles and tumults, will have passed away. There will be no sea; this aptly represents freedom from conflicting passions, temptations, troubles, changes, and alarms; from whatever can divide or interrupt the communion of saints. This new Jerusalem is the church of God in its new and perfect state, the church triumphant. Its blessedness came wholly from God, and depends on him. The presence of God with His people in heaven, will not be interrupt as it is on earth, He will dwell with them continually. All effects of former trouble shall be done away. They have often been in tears, by reason of sin, of affliction, of the calamities of the church; but no signs, no remembrance of former sorrows shall remain. Christ makes all things new. If we are willing and desirous that the gracious Redeemer should make all things new in order hearts and nature, He will make all things new in respect of our situation, till he has brought us to enjoy complete happiness. See the certainty of the promise. God gives his titles, Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End, as a pledge for the full performance. Sensual and sinful pleasures are muddy and poisoned waters; and the best earthly comforts are like the scanty supplies of a cistern; when idolized, they become broken cisterns, and yield only vexation. But the joys which Christ imparts are like waters springing from a fountain, pure, refreshing, abundant, and eternal. The sanctifying consolations of the Holy Spirit prepare for heavenly happiness; they are streams which flow for us in the wilderness. The fearful durst not meet the difficulties of religion, their slavish fear came from their unbelief; but those who were so dastardly as not to dare to take up the cross of Christ, were yet so desperate as to run into abominable wickedness. The agonies and terrors of the first death will lead to the far greater terrors and agonies of eternal death. Revelation 21:1 commentaries Matthew Henry Commentary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,833 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,756 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Online Share Posted May 4, 2017 18 minutes ago, wingnut- said: Technically, the word ocean doesn't appear anywhere in the bible, it is always referred to as sea, from Genesis to Revelation. Genesis 1:9 Then God said, “Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together into one place, and let the dry land appear”; and it was so. 10 And God called the dry land Earth, and the gathering together of the waters He called Seas. And God saw that it was good. In the book of Revelation it says "the Sea", as a singular, talks about something in a singular meaning. OCEAN, is a singular, it is not OCEANS, if you give a literal meaning, and substitute the "SEA", for "OCEAN", then we would like to know which one, because we have a number of OCEANS. Do you believe that today we still have what is called "the Sea", or it has passed away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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