Just How Close is the RAPTURE?

[Still Alive]

On ‎3‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 4:55 PM, Dennis1209 said:

This short article from the website 'Rapture Ready' outlines just how close our redemption is, if you're a pre-tribulation believer. It nicely dovetails my own view and opinion of the 'season' of the catching up of believers. Rather than copy and paste, the link is below for those interested.

http://www.raptureready.com/2018/03/03/rapture-close-thoughts-matthew-l-rice/

Last week I said it would be "next Monday". Well, lets try for the last Tuesday of the month and see how that goes for me.

[Last Daze]

2 minutes ago, inchrist said:

Pretrib is now the doctrine of salvation

That's pretty much what I hear.  Another cult manipulation technique.   All we can do is warn people.  Reality is coming, ready or not.

[Last Daze]

43 minutes ago, inchrist said:

Sorry my blessed hope doesn't lie in a doctrine called pretrib

No one's should.  Our blessed assurance is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord!

It's for everyone who has put their faith in Him.

[WilliamL]

3 hours ago, Daniel 11:36 said:

"Sorry my blessed hope doesn't lie in a doctrine called pretrib"

 

Then you are in the wrong cast son .... your choice

Once again, you use the patronizing word "son." A belittlement you use so often, though you are clueless to the ages and education of people.

All hail your self-proclaimed dadhood! (Well, at least you do, anyway.)

[Last Daze]

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

Once again, you use the patronizing word "son." A belittlement you use so often, though you are clueless to the ages and education of people.

All hail your self-proclaimed dadhood! (Well, at least you do, anyway.)

I personally think he's a troll-bot.

[Daniel 11:36]

"Once again, you use the patronizing word "son." A belittlement you use so often
 

I am 76 years old son .... how old are you?

And by the way the Lord's venture for His own is imminent .... it could happen before this day is over

If you do not want to believe this that is your prerogative, but He will make His move in a flash and if you are alive at the time you will go nowhere .... the next action will be His wrath and judgment upon a totally unbelieving world of humans

You can repent and believe in Him even during His tribulation period if you choose to do so

However, there will not be many who do this at the time .... maybe you will, but the chance is not good

     

 

Edited June 6, 2018 by Daniel 11:36

[Diaste]

10 hours ago, Daniel 11:36 said:

If you do not want to believe this that is your prerogative, but He will make His move in a flash and if you are alive at the time you will go nowhere .... the next action will be His wrath and judgment upon a totally unbelieving world of humans

You can repent and believe in Him even during His tribulation period if you choose to do so

However, there will not be many who do this at the time .... maybe you will, but the chance is not good

Jesus spoke of a time called 'the beginning of sorrows'. No doubt this refers to the time period at the end of the age before the A of D. There is little doubt the 'beginning of sorrows' corresponds to the first half of the last week as foretold by Daniel. Up to the point of the A of D in Matt 24:15 no mention of a gathering of any kind. In fact the opposite is true, "9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake." But there is a great promise given to us by Jesus, " 13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.".

There would be no 'enduring to the end' if the gathering came before Matt 24:13. The author and finisher of our faith had the opportunity to speak to a pretrib gathering at the moment the question was raised, "What will the sign of your coming and the end of the age?" But Jesus did not and went on to give the outline of the last days.

 8 All these...the beginning of sorrows.

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place,

21...then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days... 

30...then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

You say this is Israel only but a few things do not fit for Israel.

5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. 

9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

 11 And many FALSE prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 

 14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world 

The Jewish people do not fit the above, they do not believe Jesus is the Christ of God. They do not preach the Gospel and are not hated of all nations because of Jesus.

This only fits the Body of Christ, the church.

The first act is the rise of the beast and the beginning of sorrows, not a pretrib rapture.

 

Edited June 6, 2018 by Diaste

[Brother Duke]

11 minutes ago, Sojourner414 said:

Agreed; the Lord's coming is imminent, and would be known if it were not Pre-Trib. As it stands, no man knows when it is, and many erroneously apply Matthew 24 and Luke 21 in an effort to bolster their arguments. The Church was still a mystery at this point, so both of those chapters were not written for the coming Church.

Is 2 Thessalonians 2 not part of the Rapture?  If so there are several conditions that have to happen first before a rapture.  Has the man of sin been revealed yet?

 

2 Thessalonians 2:1-5 1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. 5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

[Steve Conley]

2 hours ago, Sojourner414 said:

Agreed; the Lord's coming is imminent, and would be known if it were not Pre-Trib. As it stands, no man knows when it is, and many erroneously apply Matthew 24 and Luke 21 in an effort to bolster their arguments. The Church was still a mystery at this point, so both of those chapters were not written for the coming Church.

Greetings in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ,

So...414, I suppose if we use your logic, when Jesus said "I will build my church", as recorded in Matt 16, that He was referring to some other "secret church" (like, maybe the one caught up in the "secret rapture") because, to quote you, "The Church was still a mystery at this point". Also, if we follow your reasoning, we must conclude that when Jesus told the 11 that He would come again and receive them unto Himself, He wasn't referring to them as representatives of the future church (they being the founding members), because, as you say, "The Church was still a mystery at this point". If your reasoning is consistent, you must believe that the promise of John 14:3 was only for the eleven to whom it was originally spoken. What a tangled web we weave ... .

I marvel that I once believed such foolishness as you now teach. I find it utterly amazing that tens of millions of believers can be so indoctrinated into an eschatological system of understanding that they readily wrest the Scriptures in an attempt to support their escapism. Even worse is that they have been taught that such wrangling of the Scriptures is faithful exegesis. They have taken Paul's command to rightly divide and equated it to the practice of making every text conform to their artificially derived eschatological model. That is called eisegesis, reading into the text.

So...414, Jesus asked questions, may I ask you a few questions.

1. Do you agree that the period of God's eschatological wrath is called the day of the Lord throughout the Holy Scriptures?
2. In relation to the seventieth week, or any other eschatological event, when does the day of the Lord take place?

Please know that I'm not just asking for your opinion, I would hope that you support your answers from the Holy Writ.

All praise, honour, and glory be unto the Lord Jesus Christ

[Brother Duke]

9 minutes ago, Sojourner414 said:

You tried that in the other thread Diaste, and it flopped there too. Pre-trib bases its' arguments on Scripture, the same as Mid-Trib and Post-Trib claims to,, but Pre-Trib consistently answers the questions that Mid and Post-Trib cannot answer or try to side-step. If you are going to try to play the "prejudice" card, then you just shot down your own position along with all others!

"Rational experience", eh? So you've been through the time of the Tribulation already? I severely doubt that, given the first seal hasn't even been broken yet.

But on the note of the seals, Scripture says the following:

" I looked when He broke the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth made of hair, and the whole moon became like blood; and the stars of the sky fell to the earth, as a fig tree casts its unripe figs when shaken by a great wind. The sky was split apart like a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. Then the kings of the earth and the great men and the commanders and the rich and the strong and every slave and free man hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains; and they said to the mountains and to the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the presence of Him who sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb; for the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?”  (Revelation 6:12-17, NASB, emphasis mine)

I know others who believe that the wrath part starts with the sixth seal, and I'm not going to debate them on it. But what I'm going by here is Scripture, and Scripture indicates here that wrath has come already by the time of the sixth seal. The people on earth recognize that they are in the day of wrath. The Lord opened the first seal, all the way to the sixth one, and that all of this is Him setting it into motion. Judgment has in the past involved the Lord lifting His hand from the nations He is judging, and what we're seeing here is Him opening the scroll and allowing to come forth that which He held back until now. The fifth seal in particular demonstrates that the Lord is waiting for those whom Man has slain to reach their number. When the Antichrist comes into power and starts destroying believers, that is a matter the Lord handles separately.

Now, to answer a point you made on another thread (and one you'll probably report me for, be my guest):

 

I'd be happy to tell you why I haven't refuted your posts for some time (and why I suspect others haven't either):

YOU DON'T LISTEN, AND YOU AREN'T HERE TO DISCUSS .

Thankfully, Scripture has a prescribed remedy for dealing with those who act as you do:

"Reject a factious man after a first and second warning, knowing that such a man is perverted and is sinning, being self-condemned." (Titus 3:10-11, NASB)

Though you claim to want a "sincere discussion", I severely doubt that is truly the case; a sincere discussion does not involve the maliciousness and violent intent you have demonstrated in nearly every single post of yours concerning the Rapture, Diaste. All I have seen here out of you are the actions of one who roams the board seeking whom to devour...

...and that sounds alarmingly like this passage:

"Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour. But resist him, firm in your faith, knowing that the same experiences of suffering are being accomplished by your brethren who are in the world." (1 Peter 5:8-9, NASB, emphasis mine)

When your behavior lines up with this, that would alarm anyone.  To accuse them of "attacking you" for your showing this kind of behavior is akin to claiming that "people hate water" when they flee a burst dam.

Until your behavior changes, no one is going to continue engaging you in any sort of serious discussion save that which refutes what you hold in error. And if that bothers you, then you need to start with the person you see in the mirror. You're not going anywhere bullying people on this board, and ultimately, Worthy has come under judgment in part due to YOUR actions. It has only resulted in people going elsewhere to ensure YOU cannot follow them.

 

The timing of the rapture should be the LEAST of your worries right about now, Diaste; you may wish to re-read Matthew 18:1-7.

-Sojo414 out.

 

Hi Sojourner,  what scripture can post-trib not answer?