Will God Forgive Us If We're Wrong About The Trinity

[patrick jane]

I ask this because I run other forums and we have quite a few people that do not accept the doctrine of the trinity. I have seen Christians tell other Christians they are going to hell if the don't believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is God. I believe He is but what if I'm wrong. Are we expected to understand the concept and the nature of our Triune God? What do you see and hear on this topic and what are your beliefs?

[Blood Bought 1953]

 

I think the only Ones who understand the Trinity are the Three Members of the Trinity.Some things are just beyond the grasp of human intellect .That is fine with me.

[missmuffet]

1 hour ago, patrick jane said:

I ask this because I run other forums and we have quite a few people that do not accept the doctrine of the trinity. I have seen Christians tell other Christians they are going to hell if the don't believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is God. I believe He is but what if I'm wrong. Are we expected to understand the concept and the nature of our Triune God? What do you see and hear on this topic and what are your beliefs?

The Holy Trinity is at the center of the Christian faith. The word "Trinity" is not in the Bible but the concept is. I do not think a Christian should give the words of the Holy Bible their own meaning.

1) There is one God (Deuteronomy 6:4; 1 Corinthians 8:4; Galatians 3:20; 1 Timothy 2:5).

2) The Trinity consists of three Persons (Genesis 1:1, 26; 3:22; 11:7; Isaiah 6:8, 48:16, 61:1; Matthew 3:16-17, 28:19; 2 Corinthians 13:14). In Genesis 1:1, the Hebrew plural noun "Elohim" is used. In Genesis 1:26, 3:22, 11:7 and Isaiah 6:8, the plural pronoun for “us” is used. The word "Elohim" and the pronoun “us” are plural forms, definitely referring in the Hebrew language to more than two. While this is not an explicit argument for the Trinity, it does denote the aspect of plurality in God. The Hebrew word for "God," "Elohim," definitely allows for the Trinity.

In Isaiah 48:16 and 61:1, the Son is speaking while making reference to the Father and the Holy Spirit. Compare Isaiah 61:1 to Luke 4:14-19 to see that it is the Son speaking. Matthew 3:16-17 describes the event of Jesus' baptism. Seen in this passage is God the Holy Spirit descending on God the Son while God the Father proclaims His pleasure in the Son. Matthew 28:19 and 2 Corinthians 13:14 are examples of three distinct Persons in the Trinity.

3) The members of the Trinity are distinguished one from another in various passages. In the Old Testament, “LORD” is distinguished from “Lord” (Genesis 19:24; Hosea 1:4). The LORD has a Son (Psalm 2:7, 12; Proverbs 30:2-4). The Spirit is distinguished from the “LORD” (Numbers 27:18) and from “God” (Psalm 51:10-12). God the Son is distinguished from God the Father (Psalm 45:6-7; Hebrews 1:8-9). In the New Testament, Jesus speaks to the Father about sending a Helper, the Holy Spirit (John 14:16-17). This shows that Jesus did not consider Himself to be the Father or the Holy Spirit. Consider also all the other times in the Gospels where Jesus speaks to the Father. Was He speaking to Himself? No. He spoke to another Person in the Trinity—the Father.

4) Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

5) There is subordination within the Trinity. Scripture shows that the Holy Spirit is subordinate to the Father and the Son, and the Son is subordinate to the Father. This is an internal relationship and does not deny the deity of any Person of the Trinity. This is simply an area which our finite minds cannot understand concerning the infinite God. Concerning the Son see Luke 22:42, John 5:36, John 20:21, and 1 John 4:14. Concerning the Holy Spirit see John 14:16, 14:26, 15:26, 16:7, and especially John 16:13-14.

6) The individual members of the Trinity have different tasks. The Father is the ultimate source or cause of the universe (1 Corinthians 8:6; Revelation 4:11); divine revelation (Revelation 1:1); salvation (John 3:16-17); and Jesus' human works (John 5:17; 14:10). The Father initiates all of these things.

The Son is the agent through whom the Father does the following works: the creation and maintenance of the universe (1 Corinthians 8:6; John 1:3; Colossians 1:16-17); divine revelation (John 1:1, 16:12-15; Matthew 11:27; Revelation 1:1); and salvation (2 Corinthians 5:19; Matthew 1:21; John 4:42). The Father does all these things through the Son, who functions as His agent.

The Holy Spirit is the means by whom the Father does the following works: creation and maintenance of the universe (Genesis 1:2; Job 26:13; Psalm 104:30); divine revelation (John 16:12-15; Ephesians 3:5; 2 Peter 1:21); salvation (John 3:6; Titus 3:5; 1 Peter 1:2); and Jesus' works (Isaiah 61:1; Acts 10:38). Thus, the Father does all these things by the power of the Holy Spirit.

https://www.gotquestions.org/Trinity-Bible.html

Edited March 29, 2019 by missmuffet

[Willa]

I trust in God, 3 in one.  New Christians may not fully understand but we should believe that Jesus is the Messiah Who is prophesied in the Old Testament.  They should understand that He is the only begotten Son of Father God, born of Mary.   He died for our sin because God loves us\; and we  should believe that God raised Him from the dead.  He now is in Heaven exalted with the Father.  They should know that He claimed to have existed before Abraham and existed in the beginning with Father God having created everything with Father God.  Believers should be able to surrender to Jesus and confess Him as Lord and Master just as Thomas confessed Him to be "My Lord and my God!"    They should understand that the Holy Spirit is God with us today Who calls us to Himself, Who convicts us of sin and helps us understand and apply Scripture to our lives;         He guides us and gives us power to do God's will.Throughout our lives we grow in our understanding of Who God is and about His relationship with us.

[Who me]

3 hours ago, patrick jane said:

I ask this because I run other forums and we have quite a few people that do not accept the doctrine of the trinity. I have seen Christians tell other Christians they are going to hell if the don't believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is God. I believe He is but what if I'm wrong. Are we expected to understand the concept and the nature of our Triune God? What do you see and hear on this topic and what are your beliefs?

Interesting, how can one believe that Jesus has died to save one from ones sins etc unless Jesus is God?

May I suggest that you ignore such threads unless you are prepared to raise issues like the one I've raised.

Never discuss whether someone is or is not a Christian. That is not our role.

[AnOrangeCat]

I don't believe we're expected to fully understand anything. If we were capable of perfect understanding and behavior we'd be quite different. But we are expected to try!

As for believing in the Trinity, just look at Jesus. God in the persona of Jesus is CENTRAL to Christianity. How can you have Christianity without Christ? Deny the divinity of Jesus and you have a fundamentally different religion.

[OneLight]

I know Wikipedia is not a solid source, but it is a beginning.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nontrinitarianism

Study who these groups are and what they do believe so you can approach them on their level of understanding and reason with them about what is the truth.  Remember, the only unforgivable sin is the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

[other one]

7 hours ago, patrick jane said:

I ask this because I run other forums and we have quite a few people that do not accept the doctrine of the trinity. I have seen Christians tell other Christians they are going to hell if the don't believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is God. I believe He is but what if I'm wrong. Are we expected to understand the concept and the nature of our Triune God? What do you see and hear on this topic and what are your beliefs?

We have had many very long threads on worthy over the years, and it seems to me that whether you believe in the deity of Christ depends on which verses of scripture you focus on and in some cases which translation you use.   And even because of the ambiguity of the English language what verses are actually saying.   Example is Romans 10:9

Rom 10:8-10
 that is, the word of faith which we are preaching, 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you shall be saved; 
NASB
The definition of the greek word translated Lord is on the surface a or the supreme being,,,   but can also be other:::::   

Quote

 

NT:2962
(supremacy); supreme in authority, i.e. (as noun) controller; by implication, Mr. (as a respectful title):

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

 

In reading through many of these threads I have come to the conclusion that most people don't understand the original Hebrew and Greek meanings of the word God/god.    Most people have a preconceived idea of the word's meaning of being a single entity that created the universe and is head of all...     but to an Israelite in Moses or Jesus's day would not understand it that way...

 

Is it a salvation issue...   While I personally understand that Jesus was the God of Israel that interfaced with mankind.     Did he keep any of his deity when he chose to take the form of man....    I can't tell you that for sure one way or the other.....    but he was in the form of god before that and the Father gave him back the glory he had upon resurrection so in reality it doesn't matter.   We know he was deity then a man, then back to deity again....    and one can make a scenario of the importance of keeping his deity and another of not.

Jesus in the for of god could not die for our sins because a god can't die....   could Jesus die if he was still fully God....    I suppose he can do anything he really sets his mind to do so it's still up for grabs who is right...             Does it matter is the real question and I personally don't think the Lord requires us to be a theologian to be saved.

He requires us to confess him be  Lord and to believe the Father raised him from the Dead just as Romans 10 states.

 

Edited to add::::        confessing him as Lord is not a simple thing...….    because then one is expected to do what he told us to do.....    and if one confess him as Lord, and doesn't do the things he told us to do, it appears to me that one has just made themselves a liar and not a saved born again.

[Jostler]

1 hour ago, other one said:

Is it a salvation issue...   While I personally understand that Jesus was the God of Israel that interfaced with mankind.     Did he keep any of his deity when he chose to take the form of man....    I can't tell you that for sure one way or the other.....  

I believe we can  KNOW that Jesus walked His life on earth FULLY as a man.  Part of what Jesus had to do was retake the "test" Adam failed, and pass it.  For that test to be legally valid, legally admissible evidence before the Divine Court, He had  to pass that test with  NO advantages over Adam's abilities or environment.  The "conditions" of the test had to be exact.  

Is Jesus fully man and fully God?  Yes He is, but He laid aside, completely, all the rights, privileges, powers and glory (that are legitimately His as God) to be  found in this earth as a man, fully and completely man and no more than a man.   He took that  test and passed it.  He never sinned.  Never chose against God.  Never did ANYTHING apart  from God's will.  He walked in 100% total submission to  Father His whole time here.

I think it's important to understand that Jesus walked His whole life as a son of Adam.  He was empowered in His ministry by the indwelling  Spirit of God.  And His walk proceeded with NO advantages over the conditions He left for US to walk in.   There is nothing He  ever did that  we cannot do, because we have all that  He had access to.  And that is the precious promise from Heaven, the Holy Spirit. 

As He walked, so His sacrifice empowered those "in Him" to walk.  That is why He could say  with such confidence that those who  believe in Him will do  GREATER works, than even He did.

He could have done any "work" God appointed Him to  do ...including those "greater works" He  assigns to us.  But the issue was/is timing.  It was Father who decided that the latter rain should be greater than the  former.  I suspect He  knew He would not be here for that time, but we would.   We're headed toward a day  when the works of God displayed in this earth will far exceed those recorded in Acts and the  Gospels.  And once more  He  will do those works THROUGH His own sons and daughters.

[Heybro]

Thank you, my dear brother for your insight and demonstration of Who We Are in Christ, we're followers, are we not of "Christ in Us, the hope of glory." You just keep preaching it "like it is" I'm with you in it. To God be the glory, great things He Has Done, so loved He the world that He gave us His Son...