The "Day of the Lord: Where in Revelation does it begin?

[The Light]

23 hours ago, iamlamad said:

If you wish for wrath to start at the midpoint of the week, 7th trumpet - GO FOR IT.

The week is over at the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal. Then wrath begins when the 1st trumpet sounds after the 7th seal is opened. Further, the wrath of God is over at the 7th trump.

23 hours ago, iamlamad said:

But what in the world will you do with all the evidence that wrath and the Day of His wrath starts at the 6th seal? 

Wrath doesn't start until the 7th seal is opened and the 1st trumpet sounds.

23 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Argue or disagree all you want: if you insist the first seal is NOT the church taking the gospel to the world, you will be in error, plain and simple. If you insist that seal is future, you will be in error. It was opened around 32 or 33 AD when Jesus ascended and got the book into His hands.

The rider on the white horse at the 1st seal is "an antichrist". He is the 7th king that goes forth conquering and to conquer.

23 hours ago, iamlamad said:

“The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come” (Rev. Rev. 11:18+).

Use some common sense. The nations "WERE" angry and your wrath has come. Are the nations no longer angry? Wrath did come.

23 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Thrust in Your sickle and reap, for the time has come for You to reap” (Rev. Rev. 14:15+).

In this case, the time HAS COME but the action has not happened yet. If two gun fighters meet in the street and one said "The time has come for you to die" Is the other fighter dead yet?

You constantly confuse yourself on the simplest of things.

 

 

23 hours ago, iamlamad said:

 

 

[luigi]

Correlation with what the Lord's wrath following the tribulation is about.

Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Psalm 2:1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? 2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the Lord, and against his anointed, saying, 3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us. 4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision. 5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure.

[iamlamad]

30 minutes ago, The Light said:

The week is over at the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal. Then wrath begins when the 1st trumpet sounds after the 7th seal is opened. Further, the wrath of God is over at the 7th trump.

Wrath doesn't start until the 7th seal is opened and the 1st trumpet sounds.

The rider on the white horse at the 1st seal is "an antichrist". He is the 7th king that goes forth conquering and to conquer.

Use some common sense. The nations "WERE" angry and your wrath has come. Are the nations no longer angry? Wrath did come.

In this case, the time HAS COME but the action has not happened yet. If two gun fighters meet in the street and one said "The time has come for you to die" Is the other fighter dead yet?

You constantly confuse yourself on the simplest of things.

What does the WORD tell us? The days of GT will not even START until after God gives His warning not to take the mark - and that is in chapter 14! The martyrs of the days of GT do not begin to show up in heaven until chapter 15. 

In other words, you write myths. 

As for "Were angry" and "is come" you must learn more about Greek Aorist verbs. Strongs tells us they don't give any timing information.  OF COURSE the world will be angry with the woes: they KNOW they are coming from God. 

It seems you have no idea where we are NOW in Revelation. You SHOULD though: we are at the 5th seal martyrs of the church age, and are going to be there until the rapture that ends the church age. 

Wrath starts right where John first mentioned it: at the 6th seal. It is the WEEK that starts at the 7th seal. 

The first seal was opened in 32 AD. How in the world could that be the antichrist? John used the color white 17 times in Revelation: you are trying to teach others that God would use white 16 times for righteousness and then once for evil! NEVER HAPPEN! 

Sorry, I don't buy into myths. 

WHERE YOU MISS IT: in TIME and TIMING. John really does have a chronology. Prewath has murdered it with their theories. Sliced and diced it and then reassembled to fit a wild theory. Always remember, ANY theory that must rearrange John's God given chronology will be proven wrong. 

[iamlamad]

5 minutes ago, luigi said:

Correlation with what the Lord's wrath following the tribulation is about.

Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Psalm 2:1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? 2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the Lord, and against his anointed, saying, 3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us. 4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision. 5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure.

Why do people quote 11:18 and MISS 6:¹⁷ For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Wrath begins at the 6th seal.. In chapter 11 John is just affirming WRATH still is. God is not yet over His wrath. And this is proven because God's wrath is still to come after chapter 11 in the vials. 

Where you miss it: Wrath does not "follow" "tribulation." Wrath does not follow the 7th week. Wrath starts at the 6th seal, the WEEK starts at the 7th and God's wrath continues through the ENTIRE WEEK. You cannot separate the 70th week (what some call "the tribulation") from God's wrath. His wrath is in the trumpets (first half of the week), His wrath is in the vials (second half of the week) so His wrath is for the ENTIRE week.

Next, it is impossible to separate God's wrath from Satan's wrath because they are CONCURRENT. 

When do rewards come? They are seen in chapter 2o. When will the dead be judged? Again we see that in chapter 20. In other words, in chapter 11 these things are spoken by the elders as PROPHECY: foretelling what is soon to come. Chapter 11 is a MIDPOINT chapter.

Edited July 9, 2020 by iamlamad

[The Light]

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

What does the WORD tell us? The days of GT will not even START until after God gives His warning not to take the mark - and that is in chapter 14! The martyrs of the days of GT do not begin to show up in heaven until chapter 15. 

Dude, the great tribulation is the 5th seal. Jesus comes at the 6th seal. Wrath begins at the 7th seal when the 1st trumpet sounds. Wrath is over at the 7th trumpet. What you are looking at in Rev 14 occurs during the seals. The coming of Jesus at the end of Rev 14, is the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal, is the coming of Jesus in Matt 24.

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

In other words, you write myths. 

You are so confused that somehow you have made such a mess of things that you have stumbled into the truth that there is a pretrib rapture.

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

As for "Were angry" and "is come" you must learn more about Greek Aorist verbs. Strongs tells us they don't give any timing information.  OF COURSE the world will be angry with the woes: they KNOW they are coming from God. 

Oh boy, something else for your imagination to run loose with.

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

It seems you have no idea where we are NOW in Revelation. You SHOULD though: we are at the 5th seal martyrs of the church age, and are going to be there until the rapture that ends the church age. 

The 1st seal is not opened yet. I don't see the 7th king riding, going forth conquering and to conquer.

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

Wrath starts right where John first mentioned it: at the 6th seal. It is the WEEK that starts at the 7th seal. 

Why is it that every time I respond to you I have to force myself not to begin with "Oh grasshopper"

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

The first seal was opened in 32 AD. How in the world could that be the antichrist? John used the color white 17 times in Revelation: you are trying to teach others that God would use white 16 times for righteousness and then once for evil! NEVER HAPPEN! 

How is it that Jesus tells us exactly what will happen in Matt 24 and when we read Revelation, John tells us the exact same thing. Instead of realizing that John and Jesus completely agree on end times, you have to go rogue and start imagining a bunch of baloney that is far from the truth. You are in deep confusion.

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

Sorry, I don't buy into myths. 

WHERE YOU MISS IT: in TIME and TIMING. John really does have a chronology. Prewath has murdered it with their theories. Sliced and diced it and then reassembled to fit a wild theory. Always remember, ANY theory that must rearrange John's God given chronology will be proven wrong. 

Always remember, The week begins seal 1. The week ends seal 6. Wrath begins seal 7 at the 1st trumpet. Wrath ends at the 7th trumpet. Wanna see it again. The events of Rev 13 and 14 occur in the week. The week is over with the coming of Jesus in Rev 14. Wrath begins and ends at the end of Rev 14. Wanna see it again. In Rev 15 we see those that have gotten victory over the beast. That tells that the week is over as they are in heaven. Then the wrath of God begins with the 1st vial and the wrath of God ends with the 7th vial.

NOT A SINGLE THING WAS REARRANGED. You just need understanding of what you are reading. Quit imagining things and read what it says.

[luigi]

2 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Why do people quote 11:18 and MISS 6:¹⁷ For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Wrath begins at the 6th seal.. In chapter 11 John is just affirming WRATH still is. God is not yet over His wrath. And this is proven because God's wrath is still to come after chapter 11 in the vials. 

Where you miss it: Wrath does not "follow" "tribulation." Wrath does not follow the 7th week. Wrath starts at the 6th seal, the WEEK starts at the 7th and God's wrath continues through the ENTIRE WEEK. You cannot separate the 70th week (what some call "the tribulation") from God's wrath. His wrath is in the trumpets (first half of the week), His wrath is in the vials (second half of the week) so His wrath is for the ENTIRE week.

Next, it is impossible to separate God's wrath from Satan's wrath because they are CONCURRENT. 

When do rewards come? They are seen in chapter 2o. When will the dead be judged? Again we see that in chapter 20. In other words, in chapter 11 these things are spoken by the elders as PROPHECY: foretelling what is soon to come. Chapter 11 is a MIDPOINT chapter.

It is very simple. Revelation 6, includes all events of the great tribulation that lead up to when the Lord's wrath shall commence. Revelation 7 through Revelation 13 return in retrospect in describing the world during the great tribulation and the beast's 42 months reign. Revelation 14 and 15 are a narrative of the two groups of people at the conclusion of the beast's reign, those who worship love, truth, justice, and all that is right, versus the beast's worshippers, who do not love what is right, and therefore shall experience the Lord's wrath in Revelation 16.

[iamlamad]

33 minutes ago, The Light said:

Dude, the great tribulation is the 5th seal. Jesus comes at the 6th seal. Wrath begins at the 7th seal when the 1st trumpet sounds. Wrath is over at the 7th trumpet. What you are looking at in Rev 14 occurs during the seals. The coming of Jesus at the end of Rev 14, is the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal, is the coming of Jesus in Matt 24.

You are so confused that somehow you have made such a mess of things that you have stumbled into the truth that there is a pretrib rapture.

Oh boy, something else for your imagination to run loose with.

The 1st seal is not opened yet. I don't see the 7th king riding, going forth conquering and to conquer.

Why is it that every time I respond to you I have to force myself not to begin with "Oh grasshopper"

How is it that Jesus tells us exactly what will happen in Matt 24 and when we read Revelation, John tells us the exact same thing. Instead of realizing that John and Jesus completely agree on end times, you have to go rogue and start imagining a bunch of baloney that is far from the truth. You are in deep confusion.

Always remember, The week begins seal 1. The week ends seal 6. Wrath begins seal 7 at the 1st trumpet. Wrath ends at the 7th trumpet. Wanna see it again. The events of Rev 13 and 14 occur in the week. The week is over with the coming of Jesus in Rev 14. Wrath begins and ends at the end of Rev 14. Wanna see it again. In Rev 15 we see those that have gotten victory over the beast. That tells that the week is over as they are in heaven. Then the wrath of God begins with the 1st vial and the wrath of God ends with the 7th vial.

NOT A SINGLE THING WAS REARRANGED. You just need understanding of what you are reading. Quit imagining things and read what it says.

Dude, the great tribulation is the 5th seal.  The GT at the 5th seal is MYTH. People that believe that have been misled. God is very clear about the days of GT. Jesus said they could come after the abomination that divides the week, and He also said for those in Judea to flee the moment they see the abomination. We find that fleeing in 12:6 PROVING 12:6 is at the midpoint of the week. According to Jesus then, the days of GT must come AFTER 12:6. 

Then John shows us what will CAUSE the days of GT. It will be the Beast and False Prophet forcing all to take the mark. Yet, God gives a warning BEFORE that, not to take the mark. The warning is in chapter 14, PROVING the days of GT are past that yet. Then in chapter 15 John shows us the martyrs of the days of GT only BEGINNING to show up in heaven. 

What is this saying? It is proving that the martyrs at the 5th seal are CHURCH AGE martyrs.

How is anyone to believe your posts when your first sentence is bogus?

What this post  proves to all: the writer has no concept of TIME AND TIMING in Revelation. They are stuck on PREWRATH. THEY read every scripture with prewrath preconceived glasses on and cannot see anything else. 

The truth is, EVERYTHING was rearranged. That is prewrath in a nutshell. When GOD and John are in the church age, prewrath imagines GT! How funny!

Edited July 9, 2020 by iamlamad

[iamlamad]

27 minutes ago, luigi said:

It is very simple. Revelation 6, includes all events of the great tribulation that lead up to when the Lord's wrath shall commence. Revelation 7 through Revelation 13 return in retrospect in describing the world during the great tribulation and the beast's 42 months reign. Revelation 14 and 15 are a narrative of the two groups of people at the conclusion of the beast's reign, those who worship love, truth, justice, and all that is right, versus the beast's worshippers, who do not love what is right, and therefore shall experience the Lord's wrath in Revelation 16.

⁶ And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

Question: WHEN did this happen? WHEN was the Holy Spirit sent down?

[The Light]

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Dude, the great tribulation is the 5th seal.  The GT at the 5th seal is MYTH.

I'm sure you don't understand that most of the things that are claimed to be myth are actually based on truth.

 

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

People that believe that have been misled. God is very clear about the days of GT. Jesus said they could come after the abomination that divides the week, and He also said for those in Judea to flee the moment they see the abomination. We find that fleeing in 12:6 PROVING 12:6 is at the midpoint of the week. According to Jesus then, the days of GT must come AFTER 12:6. 

LOL, Yeah that's great. Your proving verse has no legs to stand as be see the Christ born in verse 5. Try again.

Rev 12

⁵ And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Then John shows us what will CAUSE the days of GT. It will be the Beast and False Prophet forcing all to take the mark. Yet, God gives a warning BEFORE that, not to take the mark. The warning is in chapter 14, PROVING the days of GT are past that yet. Then in chapter 15 John shows us the martyrs of the days of GT only BEGINNING to show up in heaven. 

Exactly, as we can see the wrath of God has ended at the 7th trump. The verses that you quote occur in the seals. Do you not yet understand the difference between the time of Jacobs trouble and the wrath of God.

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

What is this saying? It is proving that the martyrs at the 5th seal are CHURCH AGE martyrs.

No it proves that when the wrath of God is over at the 7th trump you get another vision of what happens in the seals.

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

How is anyone to believe your posts when your first sentence is bogus?

They can believe my posts because I just post scriptures that can speak for themselves. No imagination is necessary.

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

What this post  proves to all: the writer has no concept of TIME AND TIMING in Revelation. They are stuck on PREWRATH. THEY read every scripture with prewrath preconceived glasses on and cannot see anything else. 

I believe in a pretrib rapture of the Church. You need to check your glasses.

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

The truth is, EVERYTHING was rearranged. That is prewrath in a nutshell. When GOD and John are in the church age, prewrath imagines GT! How funny!

Well you have a huge problem. You are saying that the abomination of desolation is set up at the 7th trump which begins the great tribulation and yet we see the great tribulation in rev 7. Another problem is this proves the 5th seal is the great tribulation.

Rev 7

¹³ And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

¹⁴ And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Oh grasshopper.

[iamlamad]

1 hour ago, The Light said:

I'm sure you don't understand that most of the things that are claimed to be myth are actually based on truth.

 

LOL, Yeah that's great. Your proving verse has no legs to stand as be see the Christ born in verse 5. Try again.

Rev 12

⁵ And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

Exactly, as we can see the wrath of God has ended at the 7th trump. The verses that you quote occur in the seals. Do you not yet understand the difference between the time of Jacobs trouble and the wrath of God.

No it proves that when the wrath of God is over at the 7th trump you get another vision of what happens in the seals.

They can believe my posts because I just post scriptures that can speak for themselves. No imagination is necessary.

I believe in a pretrib rapture of the Church. You need to check your glasses.

Well you have a huge problem. You are saying that the abomination of desolation is set up at the 7th trump which begins the great tribulation and yet we see the great tribulation in rev 7. Another problem is this proves the 5th seal is the great tribulation.

Rev 7

¹³ And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

¹⁴ And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Oh grasshopper.

It is totally wasted effort to answer posts based on myth. DO have a nice day!