Who is Resurrected, and When?

[Diaste]

21 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Sorry, but I don't understand your questions.

I believe you. 

 

[Selah7]

21 minutes ago, Diaste said:

Can't prove a negative. I can't prove a single thing when there is no evidence. 

Post the evidence like I do.

Here is the evidence, in the very same scriptures you keep referring to over and over.

And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.

- Revelation 7:13-15 (KJV)

Why are they before the throne of God?  …because they and their robes were washed and made white in the blood of the Lamb.  These are the ones saved by God’s Grace. 

[FreeGrace]

11 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

Your claim is "False"

The scripture speaks clearly of a time of trouble, and it "Sequentially" states "At That Time" in relationship to the time of trouble, when the book of life is open and the final judgment and resurrection of "All" takes place

I've already explained exactly what "at that time" refers to;  the Tribulation.  What happens after that is all laid out in Rev 20, which you have chosen to reject.

11 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

You bend, twist, and tear, the truth of God's words below "Scary"!

Daniel 12:1-2KJV

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

No, I've explained the truth.  But you choose to reject the truth.  Your claims about Rev 20 are clearly imaginary.

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

Well....WHO are those 'who belong to Him'? From WHERE did the come? WHAT did they do? 

[double click failed.  How many times do you need these questions answered?  Are you paying attention.  "those who belong to Him" are all who are saved.  And you still haven't proven otherwise.  You need to explain carefully WHY any group of saved people would NOT be included in that phrase.  But you don't.]

 Are those questions answered like they are in Rev 7 about the group standing around the throne? 

WHO are they in Rev 7, "These are they which came out of great tribulation,"

WHERE did they come from in Rev 7, "out of great tribulation,"

WHAT did they do in Rev 7, "washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb"

Pretty clear to me, just as "those who belong to Him" is very clear.  Anyone who has "come out of the Great Tribulation" refers to believers.

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

In contrast none of the above is answered in 1 Cor 15 about 'those who belong to Him. So it is not precisely defined, it's generally defined.

Of course you'd have to twist it that way in order to protect your opinions.  However, you are unable to prove or even explain clearly how any believer would be left out of the phrase "those who belong to Him".  It couldn't be any more clear.

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

In fact, the ones in Rev 7:14 are the ones who belong to Him.

Sure.  ALL believers belong to Him.  Adam belongs to Him.  Moses belongs to Him.  ALL believers belong to Him.  He redeemed ALL of them.  Are you not real clear on that concept?

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

And you're correct, I can't prove it 'leaves out' anyone from 1 Cor 15:23 because it's a general statement and it's trying to prove a negative, which is not possible.

[Wrong.  It's not like "proving a negative".  You think there are believers that are not accounted for in that phrase.  But you can't show why or who is being left out.  The reality is that the phrase refutes your ideas.]

 I can only go with who is included and I know for a fact it's those from GT and who faced the beast that live a reign with Christ. I have positive evidence of that.

Sure.  And 2 Tim 2:12 says the same thing.  So what?  ALL faithful believers, when resurrected "when He comes" (1 Cor 15:23) will reign with Him.  Rom 8:17b says that too.  So your evidence is incomplete.  ALL faithful believers from Adam on will reign with Him.  And ALL believers belong to Him.  That doesn't need to be proved.  It's like saying, on a clear cloudless sunny day, "the sky is blue" and you come along and say "prove it".  Just look up and see for yourself.  ALL believers belong to Him, and if you disagree, you just don't know the Word of God.

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

 

Then post the evidence of who makes up the group, 'those who belong to Him'.

Can't prove a negative. I can't prove a single thing when there is no evidence. 

Post the evidence like I do.

You don't post evidence.  You post your opinion of "those who belong to Him" ONLY include, rather than the obvious fact that ALL believers belong to Him.

Are you willing to state here and now that NOT ALL believers belong to Him?  That's the only way your claim can be proven.  So hop to it.

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

 

And I'm posting the evidence. Again and again.

Ha.  The only evidence that will help you is showing from Scripture that NOT ALL believers belong to Him.  Because that is what your opinion is.

If Paul was of your mind, he would have written 1 Cor 15:23 this way:  "some of those who belong to Him".

He could have written "ALL of those who belong to Him", but that would just be repetitive.  To say "those who belong to Him" obviously includes ALL of those who belong to Him.

What you have is NO evidence at all.  Lots of opinions, though.

[Retrobyter]

9 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said:

Shalom, Retrobyter.

I am not a scientist but I got to understand all the trouble we have for the earth being warmer a degree more or less....and it can be a lot of big trouble if the Sun gets to that..because that will greatly affect the temperature of the earth with devastating results...I do not know if we can survive something Life that...and how long would that last and how that it would affect the turns of the earth around it self, the tilt of the earth...and the orbit of the earth and the moon and the other planets that can be affected by the change in the Sun...again science was not my subject and that time 60 years ago in High school I do not remember that they taught us a lot of science in schools without labs...just from a text book...outdated for our times...I would have loved the subject if I was going to school in the present time and hear in North America. 

Shalom, Your closest friendnt.

It will all depend upon the spectrum in which the light is emitted. And, according to the Scriptures, we do survive!

So, rest easy; it's part of God's plan.

[Montana Marv]

5 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Pretty clear to me, just as "those who belong to Him" is very clear.  Anyone who has "come out of the Great Tribulation" refers to believers.

If this is the case; Why does Christ need to rule them with a rod of iron?

Only that others who are not believers come out.  Read Rev 9:20 - The rest of mankind that were not killed by these plagues still did not repent of the work of their hands, they did not stop worshiping demons and idols......  

This would include Jews who have not converted as yet.  They have not seen the Messiah return, and then they will mourn, all the clans.  In one day their sin will be removed.  They will have finished transgression, Put an end to sin, will have atoned for wickedness, which will bring in everlasting righteousness, then there will be no need for future vision and prophecy, and then they will anoint the most holy one.  Their new King of Kings and Lord of Lords.

And then there are those who come out that will need to be ruled with a rod of iron.  Demon and idol worshipers.  These are those from all nations which need to be ruled over.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Montana Marv]

If one wants to take this another step forward.  All the beheaded martyrs during the 70th Week  who are under the Altar in Heaven have all been assembled before the event of Rev 9:20 has happened.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[DeighAnn]

18 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

Correct!!  Two resurrections, one for the saved, and, 1,000 years later, one for the unsaved.

Again, not written.  Not written ANYWHERE.  The EXACT opposite is, and it is 

A resurrection for/of BOTH

How many people READING this don't think it is about A PARTY?

There will be A PARTY both for singles and married couples coming soon. 



How MANY PEOPLE do you think would conclue upon reading that that IN FACT it is about TWO PARTIES and at different times?  

Like NO ONE.  

YET, WHEN IT COMES TO THE WORDS OF GOD all of a sudden, all common sense gets shoved aside for a bunch of double talk.  


HERE is what is written as it is written

A resurrection of BOTH the just and the unjust.  This has to be the TRUTH, the SOLID foundation upon which we build. 

both the just and unjust must take place AT THE SAME TIME because that is what is written.  


TAKING what is clearly written, and CHANGING IT by adding our own 'spin' to it, BECAUSE of other conclusions we have come to in other parts of the words of God, is EXACTLY HOW Gods Truth is changed into a lie.  

No LONGER is there A resurrection but now we are supposed to believe there are 2 resurrections.  

No LONGER will it be of BOTH but we are supposed to believe it will be JUST ONE FOR NOW. 

No longer at the SAME TIME but now we are supposed to believe DIFFERENT DAYS

Personally, I believe it EXACTLY AS IT IS WRITTEN.  How could THAT NOT be GODS TRUTH?

You WROTE:
Correct!! Two resurrections, one for the saved, and, 1,000 years later, one for the unsaved.

Why would GOD who is NOT the author of CONFUSION NOT write is LIKE YOU DID, if that is what GOD MEANT? 

Are you saying HE WROTE what He didn't mean....

in favor of WRITING what He did mean,

KNOWING there would be those who would believe it exactly as He did write it?  How EXACTLY is that not being an author of confusion? 

 

IF we were talking about a verse that read THERE WILL BE 2 RESURRECTIONS, I would agree with you

If we were reading a verse that said there is A resurrection of JUST the JUST, I would agree with you

If we were reading a verse that said there is A resurrection of just the unjust, I would agree with you

If we were reading a verse that said the just and the unjust are NOT at the same time, I would agree with you...

BUT what is written  -  there is A resurrection of BOTH the just and the unjust.  










 

[truth7t7]

8 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

I've already explained exactly what "at that time" refers to;  the Tribulation.  What happens after that is all laid out in Rev 20, which you have chosen to reject.

No, I've explained the truth.  But you choose to reject the truth.  Your claims about Rev 20 are clearly imaginary.

Your claim is "False"

The time of the great tribulation "At That Time" is when the resurrection of "All" takes place, as the book of life is opened in the final judgment, just as Daniel 12:1-2 clearly teaches below

Your claim that a resurrection of the unsaved takes place 1,000 years "After" the great tribulation is "False"

Daniel 12:1-2KJV

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Edited February 24, 2023 by truth7t7