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I would say that Adam was the first model and was hand made. No need for a belly button. Jesus was begotten and came from the normal way all other humans have been made, and they have belly buttons. So while I can't prove it, I think the major difference is that Adam and Eve probably did not have belly buttons, but the rest of us including Jesus does. And if that's not the most frivolous thing you've read all day, you need to up the standards of your reading material.

Just a note from an old conspiracy guy. If you are looking for something of that nature, use Duck Duck Go for your search tool, not Google. Google helps hide stuff.

Funny guy...

In our travels, we somehow stopped adopting dogs years ago. Before we met my Beloved Wife and I both owned / grew up with several dogs. Shadrach (black cocker) latched onto us one July day after having been separated from his owners. The poor fellow was terrified of fireworks and apparently ran away in fright. He was covered in ticks and the Vet thought he wouldn't survive but he did for several years. It wasn't until the last few years that he stopped checking out people as they drove up in cars (we assume looking for his former masters). He was such a good boy. Moving around a lot in those days made pet ownership near impossible (and why we spent so much time volunteering at animal shelters). A tabby male we named D.C. (a feral who we fed at the park along with the ducks and geese) won our hearts and became our first cat we adopted. He and Shad got along great, but D.C. liked to tease Shad at times. When Shad passed we became strictly cat owners for many years. Fostered many mama cats and litters. D.C. went out early one morning and never came back. We searched and searched the nearby canyon in San Diego but never found him. Coyotes, we suspect. Broken hearted we vowed never to take in another... until we found Shalom (a dark brown Persian who was quarantined at the Woodward Center and who looked as if she had given up all hope to live). ← her previous owners used her as a breeder and when she was no longer able to breed they at least dumped her at the no kill animal center... but that still sucked. Despite the rules not to touch quarantined animals new to the center, I couldn't help but open her tiny cage and scoop her up into my arms. She needed encouragement to live. We loved her a moment and returned her to the cage and drove off, but a mile or two down the road we turned back knowing despite our previous resolve never to go through the heartbreak of losing another pet we adopted the little girl (at Halloween) ← which the Center did not allow for obvious reasons, but made an exception in our case because they knew us. Shalom, so aptly named (which we renamed her from a Spanish name for traveler Via Vallarte or something like that) was the sweetest most peaceful person you'd ever want to meet. I grew up in a large family of heatherns (lol) and for lack of furniture I guess I used to sit or lay on the floor to study the Bible or watch TV (head propped up on the foot of the sofa). Shalom would sit on my stomach as I watched TV or in the small of my back as I studied the Bible. She love aerosol whipped cream and often had a white beard when she ate it. She loved the empty boxes we used to transport groceries from Costco, sometimes a whole stack at a time, which I lovingly referred to as Shalomy's hobo neighborhood. And she loved when I'd push her around in a box lid on the floor like it was her Barbie's convertible car. Next came Indiana Jones and Miss Ginger Rogers who we adopted from a litter we found on the property we lived at the time. R2D2 and Indy would sit on shoulders (one on each side) as kittens when we took them to the Vet. R2 and their sister Leah we found homes for. Indy and Ginger we almost turned over to the no kill animal center we volunteered at (Shalom's loss after her health went south was harder on us than the losses of D.C. and Shad) but we could not give up Indy and Ginger after all. Indy was the little face peaking out through the bushes where their mother had them. My Beloved Wife saw him and he melted her heart. It was from there we rescued and fostered the litter. We credited and reminded Indy often that he was special for rescuing his family. It's only been a few years since they had to be put down (poor health... their mama who was a stray we fed where we lived at the time was in poor health and had to be put down just after we found the litter she abandoned). Long story. Sad. But painfully necessary. We believe in giving people and animals every chance to live... but there comes a point when keeping them alive is a living death sentence. We found three munchkin kittens in a flower bed where their mother abandoned them soaked to the bone from a water sprinkler. Poor things. They were sick and their eyes were swollen shut. My Beloved found them on a bike ride she used to do around the neighborhood. We came to feed them and I picked up one of them and held her to my tummy. We reluctantly put them back in a dry part of the yard and the one I picked up followed after me. Even though we lived in an apartment at the time and we had our quota of pets (Indy and Ginger) we fostered the little kittens. We nursed them back to health and they ran like a team of horses back and forth in that tiny apartment. Indy and Ginger did the same thing when they were kittens. When we were about to release the munchkins to the SPCA we had second thoughts and adopted them as the LORD opened doors for us to rent a house. This was during the financial crunch and I had just returned to my Government job after ventured out into the Limo business had gone bust... but on faith we moved into the house and the LORD provided for us the home we needed to house our small version of Noah's Ark. LOL After Indy and Ginger passed was when we adopted the first dog we've had in decades. A wire terrier whose previous owners had grown too old to care for her. Schatzi (German for sweetie) was so very well trained and the politest dog. She was in the SPCA for two years. I'm not in the habit of griping about others, but several of the workers there mistreated her and they gave her the reputation of being a mean dog that hates men and doesn't get along with most dogs and who bites. After we adopted her (and renamed her Chardonnay) we found she had bruised ribs (yiped a lot from fear and pain) and her paranoia of doors closing on her made us suspect they'd closed her stall door on her at least once. Couldn't do anything about it after the fact, but God help those I catch abusing an animal!!! The SPCA admin waived all fees (wanting to get rid of Chardonnay) when we finally decided to adopt her. We tried finding her a home but failed. Took out ads in the newspaper and everything. But this little girl who they swore hated men jumped up in my lap and covered me with kisses from day one. She got along with our kitties since day one and often touches noses with them. But we since found that she doesn't trust other people or other dogs. We assume from the mistreatment at the SPCA. Our niece got nipped when she tried to pet Chardonnay so we are very cautious about others who want to pet her. She's very pack exclusive. Then came Dakota. A large off white lab / pitbull mix who looks like Superboy's dog Krypto. We tried and tried to get her adopted. I even photoshopped her as Krypto with a cape and with a wonder woman crown on her head. She was a year and a half old and spent her entire life at the SPCA (often in a cage that was cramped and too small for her to even sit up straight. I know... We gave in and adopted her as well. Chardonnay and she had minor issues but once the pecking order was established they got along fine ever since. Dakota loves our kitties and with the most recent adopted one (Mia, who is blind but gets around so well we often forget she can't see) will stand up on her hinds and hug Dakota's snout when she gently pokes her with it. We have to get it on video! Adorable. Mia appeared on a web page my Beloved spotted one day and fell in love with her and said we had to adopt her. I responded that we just couldn't. The ark is full. My Beloved nodded (respecting my decision, acknowledging the logic of the situation) but her expression was that of heartbreak which broke my heart and we adopted Mia. She was born with eyes that were too small and were surgically removed. The SPCA switched her from cage to cage since the other cats all picked on her and ate her food. Backed into a corner and eating from the litter box, she had it rough. She lashed out often, not knowing where the next assault from cats was coming. We brought her home and the cats we already had were not too happy. Often I stepped in to break up disputes scooping Mia up and assuring her "it's okay." I guess that's how we bonded. She's my little shadow and bunk mate now. She's been on regular cat food for years now, but when we first brought her home she'd eat pretty much whatever I ate often sharing my TV tray (meat, green beans, etc). When it's meaty enough, she will still let me know she's interested in what I'm eating, but I discourage this now since cat food is better for her. I will slip her a piece of chicken of fish every now and then. My Beloved Bride is the one who loves animals the most. She inspires me and awakened in me this love for God's creatures from the indifference I once had. And she got that from her mother who was the sweetest person I ever met in my life. Sorry I got so carried away and wrote this long post.

It is very probable that the ark landed when the continents were still together. It is also likely that the tower of Babel happened ((over a century after the flood year) on the supercontinent. That would make it easy for man and animals and plants to migrate to the various areas and what are now separate continents. Something changed quickly and the continents separated, carrying all the people and life on them. This seems to have happened at the same time as the lifespans of men dropping suddenly and drastically. (the best plotting of when lifespans changed points not to the flood but the time of Peleg) It was also in the days of Peleg that the bible says that the world was split or divided. That includes nations and languages, but many also believe it includes the physical division of the land masses. This thread is to discuss the scientific or historical aspects of this.

For Israel and the Nations, but not the Body of Christ.

There is a transitional form, Ursus maritumus tyrranus, which was more like a brown bear, but showed adapations for cold, snowy, and marine environments.

I didn't know if this relates to the OP but the prophecy that Israel would be created in 1 day which happened in 1948 is in Isaiah 66:7-8.

No matter what continent men lived on they would have known about the flood. Once continents moved with the animals and people on them, there still were stories and legends of the great flood. There is also some similarities in pyramids.

Occam's razor says that people living on rapidly moving continents is the simplest answer.

I would see all these as post flood. Since laws and forces of physics were likely not the same as today, there may have also been some way to lessen gravity! (making the moving of huge blocks easy) Having some force balancing or somewhat cancelling gravity would also facilitate huge land masses moving easier. Personally I believe that the planet itself was also somehow affected, resulting in a sudden change in the length of a year (used to be 360 days) On the issue of sediment and fossils, there were plenty of those before the flood as well. Perhaps some areas where water arose from the deep tended to ebb and flow water and would be mistaken by modern science as tidal activity from seas...etc. I agree. This explains similarities in architecture, customs etc. Not only normal dispersing, but the separation caused by continents moving apart. Yes The place Job lived and the time he lived may have been closer to the time of the flood than assumed. I have a way of dating it. We know men lived somewhere around 9 centuries and change before the flood. Going forward we see a huge change that is most notable and best explained on a graph happened around the time of Peleg and Babel. No one after Peleg lived more than something like 230 years or whatever it was. Excepting people born before Babel and Peleg. (Shem etc) Even with people like Shem, I think their lifespan was shorter than it would have been if no change happened in Peleg's day. Here is an illustration. If Noah lived 600 years before the flood and 450 years after that would be 950 years. That means only 350 after the flood. If Babel was something like 105 years after the flood, that would mean Noah only lived about 245 years after Babel. That was approx the average age in Peleg's time. If Shem was 98 or 99 years old in the flood year, that would mean he probably would have been about 103 or 104 years old when Babel happened . That would mean he lived about 500 years after Babel. We don't know when the earth was divided in Peleg's day. Let's assume for the sake of an example that it was 100 years after the time of Babel. Peleg would have been a little over a hundred years old. Shem would have been about 300 years old. (a hundred before the flood, a hundred years till Babel, and another hundred years after Babel) That would mean that Shem only would have lived after the dividing of the earth (I assume this was when a change in physics and nature happened) for about 300 years! That was above average. I assume that whatever change happened that caused men to live drastically shorter lifespans may have affected those born before the change, but not quite as much. So, to the dating method point now- anyone that lived around the same as Peleg was something like 2 or 300 years post flood. Then we have Abraham and others dropping to 175 years, so that would be many decades later. (Jewish tradition has Abraham meeting Noah while Abraham was a child) So, we can use the lifespan of Peleg as a base to date people. Moses, for example was centuries later and he lived only 120 years...etc. Job lived 140 years, so by this dating scheme, that was before Moses, and after Peleg, and after Abraham etc.

LOL, it's ok. I am getting use to dealing with all the experts on Worthy....

The general explanation I've heard is that it was due to sin. Jesus took the sins of the world upon Himself and was in a way, temporarily separated from the Father. The idea is that He payed the price for all our sins and experienced the end results of that sin if only for a while: death, Hell, and separation from God.

The First Adam and the Second Adam – are their bodies the same? The First Adam. When God created the First Adam he was made from the dust of the earth. `And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.` (Gen. 2: 7) God told the First Adam to be fruitful and have dominion over the earth. `God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.` (Gen. 1: 28) The First Adam had a physical body, with flesh, blood and bones. God told Noah - `You shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood.` (Gen. 9: 4) So, we see that man`s inheritance is the earth and even though man sinned, God will restore mankind to the earth again, the new earth. We read of people of the nations on the new earth walking in the light of the New Jerusalem. `And the nations of those who are saved shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.` (Rev. 21: 24) These people on the earth will have bodies as the first Adam`s body with the ability to procreate. They will live forever for the Lord will feed them of His life – the Tree of Life. Now, let us look at the Second Adam – Jesus. (to make things clear, I am referring to Jesus after He died and rose again - His glorified Body.) `The first man was of the earth, made of dust; the second Man is the Lord from heaven. As was the man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly. And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.` (1 Cor. 15: 47 – 49) The believers who are in Christ, in the Body of Christ, will have a body like unto the Lord`s. `…we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.` (1 John 3: 2) And Jesus` body is glorified, with flesh and bones but NOT blood. `Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have. ` (Luke 24: 39) His life is by the Holy Spirit as our life will be. Our body will be immortal and incorruptible and receives its life from the Lord for we are intimately connected – Head – Body. `For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. ` (1 Cor. 15: 53) Thus, we see that there is a difference between the First Adam`s body and the Second Adam`s body. Each are made for a different inheritance in God`s great kingdom. Earthly man will have dominion over the earth as God promised. Heavenly man will have dominion over all of God`s great kingdom. `To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne…` (Rev. 3: 21)

I was responding to your post and the scripture you were quoting is concerning end time beast/antichrist stuff, so that's what I was talking about. Mark of the Beast stuff. This thread isn’t about that, so I thought I should ask what you were referring to, so I could respond responsibly. Well, LOL, you compelled me to go back and re-read the whole thread. When I saw your post last night prior to going to bed, I laughed at myself thinking I must have posted one of my comments on the wrong thread, as I am engaged in 2 others, one about Trump in “Some believe he is the chosen one of end times,” the other is mine called “Is America Missing in Prophecy.” Now, I readily admit I am getting up there in years, and often backtrack to where I previous was hoping to remember why I left to where I had gone, you know, the “why did I come in here??” Or maybe not… I laugh at myself finding it all kinda of humorous being someone assisting as a caregiver for my mother-in-law. I know it really is a blessing to have my wife as my personal adult supervision, LOL. However, enough about my fading clarity. SO, when you posted, “Keep in mind that it's not the first time this ship has had problems and ran into things.” I responded with, “Keep in mind that there are uncountable times people in power have orchestrated disasters and false flags, it's the nature of the beast.” My mentioned of “the nature of the beast” was utilizing the phrase, similarly to “if it walks like a duck…” But then you responded with “You can make your life miserable considering all possible conspiracies. Been there, done that. Let's just see how things go. I would agree that the CIA and President Johnson killed Kennedy, 9/11 was an inside job, and Saddam did not have mass destruction weapons. We overthrew the Ukraine government in 2014 and that whole mess is all our fault. I do understand what the so-called deep state is, and what it is capable of, but I also know who's in charge of it. I walked with them for about ten years in the 70s, 80s and got the inside understanding of what they intended to do.” It was to that comment that I stated that – “I agree there are many false theories out there, but we are instructed to watch and pray, and to take heed that no man deceive you. America is on the threshold of its greatest shaking, and that for the trying of the hearts of those in her who have taken the Name of Jesus Christ to themselves, calling themselves Christian. The angel of light is coming, and that in Jesus's name, and once America falls, the whole world goes into chaos and madness, as they will then move upon Israel. Judgment must begin in the house of the Lord.... At least, that is how I see it. The whole world is fake and a lie right now, and we desperately need ears to hear what the Spirit is saying to the churches if we have any hope of going through it all as overcomers. "...and it was given to him to make war with the saints, and overcome them." At this point in time in America, I doubt anything is truly accidental. Why? because they are trying to ban gas stoves and fireplaces, and get rid of gas power vehicles, move to digital currency, monitor all communication for hate and thought crimes, confiscate weapons, restrict movement, and are always pushing to get to where we are supposed to own nothing and still love it. It is about their total control, a hunger game type scenario with ruling elite and minions crammed in 15 minute cities with mini apartment cities for easier control. At least that is the fueling motivation of Satan's minions... However, being a Christian who is not ignorant of Satan’s devices (though sadly many professors of faith seem to be,) much of what happens in the world is truly just smoke and mirrors, illusions which are hard to focus upon due to the rapidness and of the news cycle talking points. In one day, we can go from a trin wreck, mass shootings, to a mass chemical spill, to another food processing plant burning down, another mass cattle kill off, to chicken farms going up in smoke, power and communications brownouts… all because of some white privilege man somewhere. But again, no worries, because we have lab-grown meat, GMO foods, vaccines, controlled and/or force medicine and treatment, police that no longer serve and protect (except the government), and the good news that we can eat bugs, all the bugs we want. However, please continue to let your moderation be know to all men. After all, we need to ration these things to the masses since the means of supply and delivery are constantly being made more difficult, if not impossible. It is just the way it is… Everything behind all the chaos is ultimately the adversary warring against the people of God, and he does it through his children whom he has given power, wealth, and position to stir the events to keep men distracted… it’s the old sleight of hand. No, I believe the ship/bridge event was absolutely planned and strategically executed, both as a distraction to the people and a means to accomplish multiple other agendas. Kinda a Pearl Harbor or Twin Towers thing… It has raised the cost of fuel already, greatly impaired that regions commodities access, and become a perfect issue for Biden to throw billions at, most of which will be funneled to other dark projects and agendas… But, why am I saying all this to you, since you say you were on the inside, know who’s in charge and to blame, and that you know what they intend to do? But surely, you being a Christian, filled and led by the Holy Spirit, know they are but being manipulated by their pride and greed, and that to do the bidding of Satan in his war against humanity and the saints. That is where all this in the end comes down to, for “Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, the fallen angels have been cast down to earth, having great wrath for he knows his time is short.” Time is short, things will accelerate in desperation, lies will but only multiply, but the one that concerns me is the peace and safety message being presented by the contender of the deep state. So yes, and no, this is and yet isn’t about the ship, it’s all way bigger than that. But regardless, I believe the ship/bridge disaster is but a small facet of the overall war and deception being continually waged on Americans, especially believers.

If he really died and got raised from the dead his response is extra stupid: But it displeased Jonah exceedingly, and he became angry. 2 So he prayed to the Lord, and said, “Ah, Lord, was not this what I said when I was still in my country? Therefore I fled previously to Tarshish; for I know that You are a gracious and merciful God, slow to anger and abundant in lovingkindness, One who relents from doing harm. 3 Therefore now, O Lord, please take my life from me, for it is better for me to die than to live!”

So does the man of sin in 2 Thessalonians 2:4

My point. Instead of accounting for the things the Hebrews believed about the world at the time, some people try to insert it into the actual message He's giving us. I don't, either. YE creationists invented it when they realized that there was no way to keep all species of animals on the ark for a year.

Your post is quite interesting. It's ALOT to think about. I'm going to seriously think about your words here and I may have questions later.

Too funny.

Astronomy Calendar of Celestial Events 2024 - Sea and Sky (seasky.org)

I rescued all of my cats through the years from my little street. Initially I was just feeding some strays but took in a tiny tortoiseshell/calico kitten in 1989 I think it was. Oh, my one cat Crystal...his elderly owner died. I had been caring for Crystal in his owner's apartment when his owner was in the hospital. After he died the apartment manager was going to toss Crystal out! Of course, I took him in.

Psalm 73 25 Whom have I in heaven but you? And there is nothing on earth that I desire besides you. 26 My flesh and my heart may fail, but God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever.

It seems we are also looking at Jesus` body when He was manifest on earth. We know that the father prepared a body for Him. (Heb. 10: 5 `Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, but a body You have prepared for Me.` We know that His body was human, flesh and bones, however His blood was - sinless, holy and divine. `How precious in the blood of Jesus. If the Blood of Christ was only sinless it would be unique, because it would be the first and only time since the fall of man that such had ever been in the world, (Rom. 3: 23) that would have made it intrinsically precious beyond degree. But it was more than sinless Blood, it was holy Blood; for Christ`s life was a holy life in peerless and matchless degree (Heb. 7: 26) Before the fall, the blood of Adam was sinless and innocent blood; but there is no suggestion that he had attained to a state of holiness and that, therefore, his blood was holy. The Blood of Christ was the first holy Blood; that multiplies the intrinsic value. Then, to crown it all, in some unparallel, inexplicable way it was divine Blood: it is described as the blood of God. (Acts 20: 28) `Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God, which he purchased with His own blood.` (Acts 20: 28) Therefore, the Blood of Christ that was shed on the cross of Calvary for the salvation of mankind, was sinless, holy and divine. The intrinsic value of the Blood of Christ was infinitely above that of the blood of a righteous or a good man or that of a martyr; it was the precious Blood of the divine and holy Saviour of the world. The shedding of that Blood, the pouring out of that life was an act once for all - never could it be repeated (Heb. 9: 26) The revelation of the Word of God is that the intrinsic worth of any human blood is of the utmost value. The intrinsic value of the precious Blood of Christ is above all imagination, assessment and degree. ` (Ref. W.A. Rowe - my first pastor)

... and if you have the Holy Spirit, you have your name in the book of life, and it is not possible to be deceived. So instead of overly concerned about end times and who's the antichrist and who's going to deceive us, maybe we should be making sure everyone has the Holy Spirit and a relationship with the Lord. Jesus knew what he was talking about when he said his sheep knows the Shepard. Who do you know that can tell you for certain what happened to this bridge? I've watched it hit it and knock it down, and I saw the lights go out and understand what that entails. I saw the wake of the ship and I took the time to look at My Radar to see the direction of the wind and the speed to see what it would do to the ship that was coasting without power. What the pilot reported, and the video shows, all adds up to being exactly what they said. It may well be that the problem was/is some very substandard fuel the ship picked up for the trip. Tests will show that, but it takes time to test it.

I think I get what you're saying, but can you show me verses in the new testament where He pulls His indwelling Spirit from a person who is joined to Him as a born-again child of God?

Perhaps your radar isn't completely faulty, but I certainly do not wish to be malicious in anyway to anyone, for am still a refining work in progress and often find myself cast down over the apparent ability of my old man to sneak up on me... he too can be a vainly religious fellow. but no brother, my desire is that we all truly learn to be fervent in our love for each other, more than excelling as great theologians. That said, I truly hope we can learn from each other. My growth in Christ has been one of constant correcting in my knowledge and understanding, much from others who labored in love with me to sow me the truth clearly and patiently, and much from the Lord, usually when I am just desiring to be still and quiet in the presence of my Father. I can count the times where just being still, He has download in my heart things that have taken weeks in scripture to unfold, all the while wondering why I never saw it before. Then He impressed upon my heart, that knowledge and understanding are "given" by the Lord. Knowledge puffs up, but real understanding humbles a man. May the Lord so enlarge your heart and increase understanding...

I know I'm gonna sound crazy lol but this is what I believe and it is very biblical. There was two Adams Both of them have to turn to Jesus and repent. There is no difference there when it comes to being saved Where the difference comes is the second Adam was the bloodline to Jesus The first Adam was the human race but God needed someone to till the soil and make sure the bloodline for Jesus, our savior was set up OK here's where it gets crazy I am not a seven day believer. I am an eight day believer. After God rested on the seventh day, that's when the other second Adam came in to play Of course, Cane was sent to take out Adam and try to destroy the bloodline, however, Seth was able to carry it on even when Satan tried to stop it again with the fallen angels and the Giants they had to be flooded out. They also wanted to destroy the bloodline. Anyway, that's a lot of information to digest lol.

Hi VA, I so agree that the Lord was like us, fully human, though without tainted blood. His blood was pure, precious and divine. it was from the Father. Then when Christ died and rose again He was given a glorified Body - immortal and incorruptible. Sorry I wasn`t too clear on that point in the op.

The bible is generally specific and many times we can find those answers in it. Other times it isn't specific enough and we need specific answers, so God directs us to them in one way or another. Has that been your experience?

Interesting topic, Marilyn. I thought for sure I had read scripture that said Jesus was fully man as we are. I looked it up and no place does scripture say Jesus was fully man, exactly, that I could find. Only that he had the attributes of man, the likeness, evidence etc; Quote: "In the four Gospels, there is ample evidence that Jesus was fully human since He was born to a human mother (Matthew 1:25), He experienced hunger (Matthew 21:18) and thirst (John 19:28). Jesus also experienced temptation (Matthew 4:1) pain and suffering (Matthew 16:21), and He died (Matthew (27:50)" I did find this though, that is the closest I could find, that he was like us in all things. “Inasmuch then as the children have partaken of flesh and blood, He Himself likewise shared in the same, that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, and release those who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham. Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.” Hebrews 2:14-17. I do not know the specifics of 'heavenly man' vs the man Adam. Thought it, fully man like us, was necessary for the sacrifice on the cross to be just. But what do I know of the mysteries of God... Thanks Marilyn. got me digging...

I agree there are many false theories out there, but we are instructed to watch and pray, and to take heed that no man deceive you. America is on the threshold of its greatest shaking, and that for the trying of the hearts of those in her who have taken the Name of Jesus Christ to themselves, calling themselves Christian. The angel of light is coming, and that in Jesus's name, and once America falls, the whole world goes into chaos and madness, as they will then move upon Israel. Judgment must begin in the house of the Lord.... At least, that is how I see it. The whole world is fake and a lie right now, and we desperately need ears to hear what the Spirit is saying to the churches if we have any hope of going through it all as overcomers. "...and it was given to him to make war with the saints, and overcome them."

He sure does speak us in many ways.

That does not mean that they moved when waters came up in the flood. Yes water was under the surface before the flood. That has no connection to continents moving that we know about. You seem to be trying to use the water surfacing in the flood as the mechanism for rapid continental drift.

Psalm 65.1-2: "Praise waiteth for Thee, O God, in Zion; and unto Thee shall the vow be performed. O Thou that hearest prayer, unto Thee shall all flesh come."

I simply ask because in many places it is simply a referencing the whole know world, or the whole domain of and empire. Such as where Paul asks, "Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world." Which was necessary before the words of Jesus concerning the destruction of the temple and disbursement of the Jews would happen. "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come." "And he said unto them, [the apostles] It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power. But you shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and you shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth [or region, province, state/country, land]."

In a few hours I am off to pick up the next two foster dogs that I will look after till they find new homes ( making a total of 527 dogs I have been able to love ) They are 11 week old huskie crosses and will make 8 dogs here in my home at the moment .. the most I have had at one time is 24 but they tend to be puppies n0t huge dogs when I have that number ..perhaps it is just as well I dont have 22 acres

Psalm72 18 Blessed be the Lord, the God of Israel, who alone does wondrous things. 19 Blessed be his glorious name forever; may the whole earth be filled with his glory! Amen and Amen!

There s a reason for hiding the author. Hebrews is about the Person of Christ. No distractions by other personalities. The Book is written to the Hebrews. "Hebrews" means "River Crosser". It is a very clever title because while it addresses those who once crossed the Jordan, the second tier of revelation addresses those who have been Baptized (1st Cor.10:1-11). The reason for the Book is crucial. The Law of Moses promised rewards for adherence. To summarize them I would say that the rewards of Law-keeping are health, wealth, safety in the Good Land, safety in daily tasks, big harvests, many children and long life. In Hebrews Chapter 10 we learn that when these Hebrews embraced Christ they did it gladly. But then came persecution including the loss of worldly things (verses 32-34). The reaction is; "Under Law we were truly blessed. Now we are obedient to Christ and suffer and have our blessings taken away. LET US RETURN TO MOSES!" The Book is written to reverse this thinking. The way the Holy Spirit does this is to show the superiority of Christ as opposed to Moses, angels, the Aaronic Preisthood and the sacrifices. There are five grievous warnings in the Book to make clear the consequences for turning back. You took Chapter 6. Let us examine it briefly. Hebrews Chapter 6 starts in Chapter 5. The Hebrews are accused of not knowing basic doctrines. They are accused of no growth in the truths that make up everyday Christianity. Ephesians 4 outlines God's plan for maturing in THE Faith (what we believe). The Hebrews could not but be confused. They lived on a diet of spiritual milk. But the effect of being schooled in THE faith is RIGHTEOUSNESS for entering the Kingdom. The Law produced the following mentality; 1. On Sunday my neighbors goat wandered into my back yard. I added it to my flock of goats. 2. On Monday my conscience got to me and I not only returned the goat as per Law with four more, but I took a lamb to the priest for my sin (Ex.22). 3. On Wednesday, I made love to my wife who was menstruating. 4. On Thursday my conscience gets to me and I offer for my uncleanness. .... and so on. There is always an offering to fall back on for my sins. But those who have left Moses and hear Christ, if they sin, have NO offering to fall back on. Christ died ONCE for all. This is at once fabulous, but it provides no reprieve for a man who once accepted Christ and then rejects Him. There is no sacrifice. Your parting from Christ leaves you without a way. Of course, you can return to Christ and be accepted, but the author of Hebrews is dealing with a man who returns to Law. The word "impossible" in verse 4 describes the sacrifice of Christ. It is NOT POSSIBLE that He should die again like the sacrifices I outlined above. What are the consequences? The convert to Christianity lives for the REWARD of the "AGE TO COME". He has only "tasted" the blessings. The age to come is when his fruit is shown. God wants fruit and in return gives REWARD. But if the once enlightened Christian returns to Moses he produces "thorns". During the Millennial Kingdom he will be burned. But notice the burning is not final. He is only NIGH to a curse! 1st Corinthians 3 confirms the burning. So does Revelation 2 (written to a Church about sufferings). 10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. 11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death (Re 2:10–11). Hebrews is not about salvation. It is addressed to those already saved. It is all about abiding by God's New Testament economy which tell us that we will suffer for the gospel and receive our reward when Jesus comes. The verses above IMPLY being "hurt" of the Second Death if you do not overcome. In Hebrews the "backsliding" is sliding back to Moses and the Law.

7 years tribulation for who? From my understanding the persecution of the saints in Israel lasts for a time,times and a half=3.5 years. Where do you see the saints having tribulation for 7 years? Daniel 7 24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings. 25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. 26 But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. 27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

I imagine the strategy was to make it impossible for him to appeal through an excessively large bond requirement, so this reduction will probably make them go crazy while they try to figure out some other way of stopping an appeal so they won't have to face a high potential of being overturned. Things just keep getting more and more interesting.

Shalom, choir loft. Right. Paul said, they are a "law unto themselves." And, they were given certain laws by God after the Flood. They were not to eat meat with the blood still in it, and they were told by God, Genesis 9:6 (KJV) 6 "Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man." This law of capital punishment fell upon ALL human beings (and animals, too) after the Flood. Thus, these laws are common to all. As far as the Law given at Mt. Sinai to Mosheh ("Moses"), not all Gentiles are privy to it; however, they can still be held to the Law because it is God's requirements for the children of Israel who were to be the priests to the Gentiles. Correct, again. The Law was our schoolmaster - our teacher - to show us our complete need for God's justification (not "salvation"). It shows us that we are INCAPABLE ON OUR OWN of appeasing God, no matter how hard we try. Well, this is close, but there seems to be too much emphasis on keeping God's Law, which it's been demonstrated we are INCAPABLE of doing. God is a COMPLETELY HOLY GOD and a PERFECTLY RIGHTEOUS GOD! If one has sinned even once, then it is IMPOSSIBLE to undo the sin in one's life! God sees all of time at once! No future deed is going to wipe out the past deeds we have done! God HIMSELF must step in and do what is otherwise impossible for us! THAT is how God JUSTIFIES an individual. He CALLS us "RIGHTEOUSNESS" IN SPITE of our sins! This can ONLY be done through the finished work of Yeeshuwa` ("Jesus") on the cross, for it was there that God called His Son, "SIN!" and poured out His wrath upon that SIN! By making Him our Sacrifice for sin, God can perform the transfer, and we legitimately, legally are called "HIS OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS FOUND IN HIS SON!" (2 Cor. 5:21) But, remember, "by the deeds of the Law NO FLESH shall be justified!" (Romans 3:20). Absolutely not; the Law is PERFECT because GOD is PERFECT! Paul said, Romans 7:7-12 (KJV) 7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, "Thou shalt not covet." 8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without (outside of) the law sin was dead. 9 For I was alive without (outside of) the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me. 12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. You're right ... up to a point. However, Gentiles are not among those whose "minds and hearts of those He has redeemed by His blood" NATURALLY! Only redeemed Gentiles are! Natural Gentiles who have not yet known to make the Messiah their sacrifice for sin aere NOT (or NOT YET) redeemed by His blood! You're confusing the Law, which is the set of rules governing the sacrifice, with the sacrifice itself! God's LAW is the "HOW" the sacrifice is to be made; the Sacrifice is the "WHAT" (or rather, the "WHO") is being sacrificed. Well, we AREN'T "saved by the LAW!" We are JUSTIFIED by God THROUGH HIS SON keeping the whole LAW! That's not a "license to sin," because God won't put up with that! Once we are His children, He deals with us as sons (and daughters), chastening us as necessary! Once God through His Ruwach haKodesh has put His Law into our hearts, we don't WANT to go against it! He has given us a conscience to do His Law, not because it's required, but because we LOVE HIM! It's not a matter of "what we have to do" anymore; it's a "what we GET to do" now through the power of His Ruwach! The matter of our justification and our redemption and our adoption is SETTLED! We become His children, and He never forsakes us! No, they are NOT the same thing. The Law are the RULES to follow that God has established; the Grace of God is the MEANS by which He has provided justification THROUGH HIS SON'S FINISHED WORK, both in KEEPING the Law completely, and in DYING as our Sacrifice for sin. We cannot be justified by God without the Sacrifice called "sin" being killed on our behelf (when we make His death our sacrifice for sin)! Only then, can God pronounce us "His own Righteousness" found within His Son! "Emasculate?!" That means to make someone "less than a man!" No, Jews are required to keep the commandments, all 613, of them because they are God's chosen people! But, Paul - a Pharisee - told us that NO ONE could keep all of the commandments perfectly (and he should know)! No one, that is, except the Messiah of God. The animal sacrifices would only COVER sins for a year, but the Lamb of God - haKeves 'Elohiym - REMOVED our sins completely! The author of Hebrews told us this, Hebrews 9:23-28; 10:1-25 (KJV) 23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: 25 Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others; 26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: 28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation (RESCUE)! 1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can NEVER with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. 2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. 5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, "Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me: 6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure. 7 Then said I, 'Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.' " (Psalm 40:6-8) 8 Above when he said, "Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure" therein; which are offered by the law; 9 Then said he, "Lo, I come to do thy will, O God." He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second. 10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: 12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 From henceforth expecting (anticipating) till his enemies be made his footstool. 14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. 15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, 16 "'This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days,' saith the Lord, 'I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; 17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.'" (Jeremiah 31:33-34) 18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin. 19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, 20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; 21 And having an high priest over the house of God; 22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;) 24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: 25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. You're correct on several fronts, but don't think for a moment that believing in Yeeshuwa` as the One through whom we are justified means that we have replaced God's Law! The Law hasn't been touched or abandoned (by those who know better); we still must keep God's Law, however, not to be accepted by God, but to make God happy because we LOVE God! Only the Old Mosaic Covenant, i.e., the Covenant that God made with the children of Israel at Mount Sinai, will be replaced by the New Covenant that God will make with the houses of Israel and Judah. That is the ONLY thing that shall be replaced. The current Covenant of interest, though, is the DAVIDIC Covenant of 2 Samuel 7, repeated in 1 Chronicles 17. THAT is the Covenant that was repeated by Gabriel to Mary in Luke 1, and it is THAT Covenant that was presented to the Jews for 1/2 a Week of Daniel 9. For three and a half years, the Gospel of the Kingdom (Isaiah 52:7) was heralded to the Jews, but they rejected their KING-APPARENT (the MESSIAH), and He left them DESOLATE (as predicted by Gabriel in Daniel 9:27) until that which is decided against them is poured out upon the desolate. He said He would return when they can say, "Baruwkh haba' b-shem YHWH." (Matthew:23:37-39). Perhaps, but all we can do is control our own actions, and I prefer to keep God's Law to honor Him because I love Him and want to please Him through the power of His Ruwach haQodesh. Oh, and one more thing; if a person has been justified by God through the finished work of the Messiah, then he or she will NOT go to the Lake of Fire.

If non-Jews aren't required to live by the LAW, then none of them could be saved. It is the LAW that tells us we need salvation. It is the LAW that tells us we need to approach God for atonement. It is the LAW that prescribes the method by which God has established our justification. None other. There is no other way a man can be saved. None. The LAW is not dead...has not been abolished. (Matt 5:17) Jesus said so. Did He lie about it? How then ought we to live? If non-Jews aren't required to live by the LAW, then its perfectly ok for me to kill you, rape your wife, steal your goods, burn your house to the ground and blame you for the whole affair. Sounds more like a middle east theocracy to me than the LAW of God operating in the minds and hearts of those He has redeemed by His blood - by the LAW. Are we saved by the LAW so that we can put our hands on any filthy thing we desire? THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A LICENSE TO SIN. The Ruach ha-Kodesh (Holy Spirit) puts God's LAW into our hearts so that we can live by it, not so we can play religious games with it. Nowhere does the Bible say those for whom Christ died are allowed to SIN without restriction. Everywhere does it say we are to live by the LAW as He has given us GRACE to do so. Fifty days after Easter/passover, Pentacost demonstrated God's Gracious gift of the Holy Spirit - His gift of grace to live in His will. Fifty days after Pesach/passover, the feast of Shavout celebrates God's Gracious gift of the LAW to Moses - His gift of grace for atonement. BOTH observances fall on the SAME HEBREW CALENDAR DAY. Is this a coincidence or is God saying something very important about LAW & GRACE? They are the same thing! We are called to live in accordance with the LAW as God gives us GRACE to do so. Are non-Jews required to emasculate themselves, to restrict their diet and to observe Jewish holidays? They are not required to do so because they aren't CHOSEN of God to keep them, but they ARE required to live by that which justifies them before God - THE LAW OF MOSES. The Post-modern church has betrayed the gospel....that gospel once delivered to non-Jews BY JEWS, but a church that thinks it can live in hypocrisy and replace God's LAW with its own ordinances and with its own traditions .... THE SAME error that the pharisees of Jesus' time presumed they could do as well. So go out and tell yourself you are justified in your SIN, that you can break God's LAW applicable to all men....and see what happens. The first thing that will happen is that your church will close its doors permanently. And that's exactly what's happening today. Don't you get it? I hope so. The post-modern church and all its disciples are too busy wallowing in SIN and justifying itself in false grace to understand God's will or TO DO IT. They shall have their reward in the lake of fire. Hopefully, you will not follow them in their error. that's me, hollering from the choir loft... (Isaiah 6:9-10)

And of course the scripture goes on to say how important it is for husbands to love their wives as Jesus loves the church....... Important to include the complete scripture I think 🙂 .

I would imagine that household, that marriage, is already fully in disobedience to God to start with, The Godly responsibility for the spiritual state of a household is the duty of the husband, not the wife, and that is no small responsibility.

I am sure this topic is going to go well in this generation.

Did you change your post from asking about 1948 being the creation of modern Israel ???? I don't see that post, but I suggest an answer is found in the 1917 Balfour declaration

Shalom, R. Hartono. Only the righteousness of HaShem! What you must understand is that it's not "Judaism" that becomes "the lighthouse of chosen people for the world"; it's the fact that they will come to their Messiah before much longer and recognize HIM as their Messiah. When they do this, they will fulfill at least two prophecies: namely, Yeeshuwa` promising that they wouldn't see Him again until they could welcome Him back (saying, "Baruwkh haba' b-shem YHWH"), and the good news about the Kingdom being heralded in all the world before He returns.