Is the Falling Away a false teaching ?

[Marcus O'Reillius]

8 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

2. Yeshua` arrived in the New Jerusalem, the "Tent of God," His Father's House. John 14:1-3.

I'm sorry, I almost missed this one.

The New Jerusalem does not come down until AFTER the Millennium.
Saying that Jesus goes to the New Jerusalem 2,000 years ago is NOT supported by Scripture in John 14:1-3.

Edited November 8, 2016 by Marcus O'Reillius

[Marcus O'Reillius]

8 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

12. Following the GWTJ, the ground (the surface of the earth) and the sky will be re-formed. Rev. 21:1.

Again, "re-formed" would be your interpretation.

"passed away": aperchomai as used in the Bible means: to go away, depart, to go away in order to follow any one, go after him, to follow his party, follow him as a leader, to go away, of departing evils and sufferings, of good things taken away from one, of an evanescent state of things.

Changing the meaning of the words in Scripture to support your eschatology is something we should not do.
If we have to change the Bible to fit our eschatology: we are in error.
If our eschatology does not match what is in the Bible, we should change what we think ~ and not re-form Scripture to suit our own ends.

[Revelation Man]

On 11/5/2016 at 10:24 AM, eileenhat said:

Why do you feel 'gathered together' means a rapture event?

 

I understand that is a common idea, ie. 'a rapture'.

To me, it is just that, an idea, and not ....ok here I go....a Biblically correct interpretation of what has in fact, already occurred (just to throw in the final gauntlet).

OK, my election work is over, been busting my chops for a couple of weeks, time to answer some questions. I apologize if I seemed short in the last few weeks but been putting in long hours and not eating right, and with my diabetes that is a recipe for high blood pressure and sometimes being a little flustered. 

 

eileenhat, what would you assume a gathering together unto Christ means ? We are also told in 1 Corinthians 15 that we will be Harpazoed (Raptured/Snatched Away) to be with the Lord in the sky. At that time our corruptible body must be changed to incorruptible, hence we will all die. 

HARPAZO (Rapture, Take, Snatch, Force, Pull, Pluck, Catch, Catch Up, Catch Away) Scriptures

Definition: Harpazo

v.

1. to seize, carry off by force

2. to seize on, claim for one’s self eagerly

3. to snatch out or away

~ from Thayer’s (New Testament Greek-English Lexicon)

 

In the Greek New Testament, the word harpazo is found a total of 17 times in 13 different verses. Each time harpazo is used this verb refers to a quick or sudden often violently physical “snatching away” or “catching away” of a person, a thing, or an idea. More important is the fact that in 5 of these 17 times harpazo is used in the New Testament harpazo ALWAYS refers to the literal physical (bodily) removal of a faithfully righteous human being from one place to another, or from one sphere of existence to another. The 5 times harpazo is used involving faithfully righteous people are when:

1. Philip is harpazo’d from the presence of the Ethiopian eunuch to a different location miles away (see Acts 8:39, AKJV)

2.  Paul is harpazo’d from the Earth to the Third Heaven (see 2 Corinthians 12:2, AKJV)

3. Paul is harpazo’d from the Earth to the Third Heaven; second reference (see 2 Corinthians 12:4, AKJV)

4. Bride of Christ is harpazo’d from the Earth to the clouds to meet Her Groom (Christ Jesus) in the air (see 1 Thessalonians 4:17, AKJV); the understanding here is that the Bride will be taken to Heaven to be with Her Groom

5. Christ Jesus is harpazo’d from Bethany near the Mount of Olives to His Throne in Heaven (see Revelation 12:5; cf. Luke 24:50-51; Acts 1:9; AKJV)

Each one of the above five supernaturally powerful acts of the Holy Spirit by which literal bodily removals of humans either from one place to another on Earth or from off of this Earth to Heaven proves that the Rapture is a biblically sound doctrine. In fact, the English words Rapture and Raptured actually are derived from the Latin verb rapio(catch up or take away), and rapio is used in the Latin Vulgate Bible (also referred to as The Vulgate).

The point here is that many of America’s English words, like Rapture and Raptured, and etc., are derived from words found in the Latin Vulgate Bible—the most commonly used translation of the Holy Bible. St Jerome’s late 4th-century A.D. revised Latin translation of the old Latin Biblical Texts became The Vulgate, and The Vulgate was used over 1,000 years before the Protestant Reformation started! In essence, no other Holy Bible translation has been used longer than the Latin Vulgate Bible, and that includes the highly promoted Authorized King James Version (AKJV)!

So then, believers who doubt that the idea of a Rapture is in their English translations of the Holy Bible need to understand that it is from the Greek New Testament manuscripts that St. Jerome, scholar/translator, originally renders the Latin rapiemur (the first person plural future passive indicative tense of rapio) from the Greek harpagesometha(the first person plural future passive indicative tense of harpazo). Furthermore, in the English versions of 1 Thessalonians 4:17, rapiemur has been translated from Latin into English as either “we shall be snatched,” or “we shall be grabbed,” or “we shall be carried off,” and so forth. Similarly, harpagesometha has been translated from Greek into English as “we shall be caught up” or “we shall be taken away,” and etc. Moreover, as already mentioned, with every Latin and English translation of harpagesometha the meaning of this Greek verb always connotes a catching or taking that will be a violent, sudden event!

The point to this brief grammar lesson is that, as far as the meaning and tense of the Latin word rapiemur are concerned, this word is in agreement with the Greek word harpagesometha, since rapiemur and harpagesometha are the same tense and they both mean the same thing—a sudden and physical withdrawal; a seizing; a snatching, and so forth. So then, there can be no denying that English words like rapt, raptly, raptness, rapture, raptured, rapturous, rapturously, rapturousness, raptor, and so on, undisputedly are derived from rapio’s verb forms such as rapere, rapui, raptus, rapiemur, rapturo, and etc. Moreover, since rapio’s verb forms are accurate translations of the Greek harpazo’s verb forms, then it doesn’t matter if someone uses the AKJV’s “caught away” or “caught up” or if he/she uses the word “raptured,” or “snatched away,” or “taken up,” or “plucked,” or “taken by force,” and so forth, because they all mean the same thing—a very sudden nonconsensual seizure.

 

So as you can see, the Rapture is straight from Paul's mouth. And he says, I SHOW YOU A MYSTERY....The word musterion used for Mystery means a SECRET by Gods Silence.  The Rapture of the Church has nothing to do with Israel, hence it was never mentioned, or a Secret by Gods silence. Israel doesn't need to know about the Rapture, unless they are Messianic Jews, and they do know via Paul.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

As to the rest of your points, I have no real problem as they are basically good summations of Scripture, and for the most part, with the noted exceptions above, I even think you have them sequenced in their proper, eschatological, sequence order.

[Revelation Man]

On 11/5/2016 at 9:56 AM, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

What Benny Hinn does is NOT the work of the Holy Spirit, it is the work of Satan and I am not calling the genuine work of the Holy Ghost evil. BTW The unpardonable sin no longer applies. That applied only to the Pharisees, who had Jesus/God standing before them and they still called Him evil.

 

Wrong, you do not seem to grasp what it BLASPHEMY of the Holy Spirit means......

22 Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw. 23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David ?

24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: 26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand ?

27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out ? therefore they shall be your judges.28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. 29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house. 30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.

31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

 

So you want me to believe that this is no longer in place, even though Jesus had not even GIVEN the Gift of the Holy Spirit unto the Disciples and Church. It is easily understood exactly what Jesus is saying, and his reasoning. The Holy Spirit has a JOB TO DO, and that is to build the Body of Christ, Jesus will be/is in Heaven right after he speaks this. When Ananias and Sapphira lied to the Holy Spirit (after Jesus' Death) they Died straightaway.  Jesus is saying you can lie/blaspheme me it the Father and it will be forgiven you, but if you LIE ON THE HOLY SPIRIT it will not be forgiven, and that is because the Holy Spirit has to build the Body of Christ, God/Jesus can not have people going around saying, That is of Satan when it is of the Holy Spirit.

Now what surprises me, I guess it shouldn't, is people who call themselves Christians can not even understand the works of the Holy Spirit. The Bible says the Spirit testifies of the Spirit. In other words, those who have the Holy Spirit should always be able to understand the works of the Holy Spirit, instead they blaspheme the Holy Spirits work. Let it be a warning......Do not blaspheme the Holy Spirit.

On 11/5/2016 at 9:56 AM, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

Look up on youtube a video called Megachurch false prophets, its a 3 hour video that is a damning expose on the lies of the televangelists.

Have you not even tried to pay attention to what I said? You haven't even tried to answer the charges I brought against them.

Your first mistake is you listen to the WORLD and the ACCUSERS, Satan is our Accuser in Heaven night and day. Secondly, are there some of those that are not of God ? Sure, but trying to mix them all into one batch is wrong, you have to understand the Holy Spirit. I will let God judge them UNLESS they bring forth false doctrine, then I will challenge it. I have read Brother Hinns books and watched, unlike you it seems, his teaching sermons, all you see is his healing services it seems and you DOUBT that is true, but you would be wrong, God is healing people there, that is his calling, if you can not see the works of the Holy Spirit it is because you are living in doubt and hearing the Accuser. 

I also have read much of Brother Hagins books, he is a man of God also. I do not allow WORLDLY People to shape my info on Godly people, I do it myself, you watch a "YOUTUBE VIDEO" made by some Accuser of the Brothers. NOT ME. I understand what is of the Holy Spirit by the Holy Spirit that lives in me. It is not that hard to do.

On 11/5/2016 at 9:56 AM, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

THEY ALSO DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THE BLOOD OF CHRIST ATONES FOR SIN.

 

Just what I was speaking of above, you are taking one or two people and saying all of the ones you mentioned believe this way, which you know is NOT TRUE, my first book I read by brother Hinn is The Blood........you see how you are smearing all with a broad brush ? And that is wrong.

On 11/5/2016 at 9:56 AM, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

ITS ALSO PROVEN THAT THE SO CALLED HEALINGS OF HINN, AND PETER POPOFF AND OTHERS ARE ALL FAKES

 

This is a great example here. You are citing WORLDLY UNGODLY PEOPLES findings,  who have an Anti-God agenda. NO ONE SAYS, nor does brother Hinn say everyone that comes up gets healed, that is YOUR PERCEPTION, and it is a naive perception. Many, Many that come get healed, right before your eyes. and you focus on hose who DON'T but profess to. WATCH....

There are many times when Brother Hinn listens to a person who says I have been healed, he prays with them, believes with them, but doesn't reaffirm their position, because GOD DOESN'T HEAL IN OUR TIMING, it is always in His timing, don't you think many people come forth who God says, ITS NOT YOUR TIME. yet they try to claim that which God does not desire at this time. Remember Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane ? He prayed that the cup be taken from him, but he then said, Nevertheless, not my Will but Your will be done. THAT'S THE POINT........many come forward and Demand to be healed, say they are healed but it is NOT GODS WILL at that time per se.....What should brother Hinn do in these cases ? Tell them, God has said he is not healing you today !! You see how stupid that would be and inhumane that would be ? But all you see is worldly men on YOUTUBE,PROVING every person that claimed to be healed wasn't healed. NO KIDDING, but that doesn't mean Benny claimed they were healed by God either, he just prayed with those that claimed to be healed and agreed with them. WHY WOULD ANYONE think every person that comes up on that stage has been healed ? Therein lies your lack of understanding to the situation. So because some PERSON of the WORLD proves half the people that came up and CLAIMED to be Healed weren't healed, you seem to think that is ground breaking info. And I bet whoever did the Story, sent people up, for just that purpose, which meant in some cases you have probably been suckered. The question is does God heal people in Brother Hinn's services, and the answer is unequivocally YES. Anyone that has the Holy Spirit can see that. 

 

They point is, you can not see the work of the Holy Spirit of those actually healed by Gods movement, because your eyes are upon what Satan wants you to look at. 

 

God does want to bless us all, He says it. Have you not read the bible ? He says he will give us SEVEN FOLD....why are you not believing what God says ?

[Retrobyter]

On 11/8/2016 at 8:19 AM, Marcus O'Reillius said:

No.  There is no Scripture which describes immortal, imperishable people residing in the land of Israel, which is apportioned to the twelve tribes in Ezekiel chapter 48.
Furthermore, we have no need for a ritualistic, periodical, system of animal sacrifice which is in Ezekiel and has yet to be fulfilled.

In all the Millennium passages in Isaiah, there is no mention of immortal, imperishable people living alongside people who are mortal and perishable.

Now an omission of a fact does not mean it is not, but you have no direct evidence for what you have concluded in your own mind.
_________________________________________________________________

Where Jesus is going in John 14:1-3 is to Heaven - and not just the sky; but the abode of the Father.
That is where He is going to prepare a place for us.
Jesus is not saying He is going to Israel when He informs the Disciples of His soon-to-be departure from them.
He is giving them a future promise, for which Christians all over still hope.
_________________________________________________________________

We will rule on the earth, and in the final portion of this old earth's time, after Satan is loosed from his prison (the abyss?) and incites the whole world (who once lived in peace under Christ's iron rod rule administered by us) ~ they come upon God's "camp" at Jerusalem.

Rev 20:9 And they came up on the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, and fire came down from heaven and devoured them.

NOTICE: we are not apportioned any land in Revelation, but are relegated to the "beloved" city, and our "camp."

parembole, as used in the Bible means: 1.an encampment.  This refers to a camp of Israel in the desert.  It is also used for the city of Jerusalem, inasmuch as that was to the Israelites what formerly the encampment had been in the desert.  It can also be used for the sacred congregation or assembly of Israel, as it had been gathered formerly in camps in the wilderness.  Alternate definitions which are not pertinent: It is also used for the Roman barracks in Jerusalem (Antonia) and the second definition 2: an army in a line of battle.

Now, one: WHEN the land of Israel is divided, a special portion, "a holy portion", "an allotment to the Lord" will be made - Ezekiel 45:1
Two: Eze 45:4 It shall be the holy portion of the land; it shall be for the priests, the ministers of the sanctuary, who come near to minister to the Lord, and it shall be a place for their houses and a holy place for the sanctuary.

Thus, we can find where we have a temporary abode in Jerusalem, a camp.
__________________________________________________________________

As to heaven, which you have gone on and on at great length (and as to your long posts: literally nobody reads them) - words can have more than one meaning:

Heaven is a place too; not just the sky.

heaven: The place where God most fully makes known his presence to bless. It is in heaven where God most fully reveals his glory, and where angels, other heavenly creatures, and redeemed saints all worship him. (57 A.1) ~ (from Systematic Theology, Copyright © 1994 by Wayne Grudem. All rights reserved.)

Heaven is our true home, where our citizenship resides, and where our inheritance and treasures are.  (From the Epistles of Paul and Peter).
Heaven is where we will be arrayed before the Throne with palm branches in Rev 7:9-17.
 

Shalom, Marcus.

LOL! Oh, really? Ever think about this passage?

Revelation 20:4-6
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
KJV

And, for just whom are they priests of God and of His Messiah? Just where will they be reigning with Him a thousand years? And, how is it possible to reign with Him a thousand years without being "immortal, imperishable people?" This doesn't take place in "Heaven," friend!

Have you considered Z'kharyahu's prophecy? For the sake of consistency in Hebrew names found in both testaments, I'm using the Complete Jewish Bible:

Zechariah 12:9-14
9 “When that day comes, I will seek to destroy
all nations attacking Yerushalayim;
10 and I will pour out on the house of David
and on those living in Yerushalayim
a spirit of grace and prayer;
and they will look to me, whom they pierced.”

They will mourn for him
as one mourns for an only son;
they will be in bitterness on his behalf
like the bitterness for a firstborn son.
11 When that day comes, there will be
great mourning in Yerushalayim,
mourning like that for Hadad-Rimmon
in the Megiddo Valley.
12 Then the land will mourn,
each family by itself —
the family of the house of David by itself,
and their wives by themselves;
the family of the house of Natan by itself,
and their wives by themselves;
13 the family of the house of Levi by itself,
and their wives by themselves;
the family of the Shim‘i by itself,
and their wives by themselves;
14 all the remaining families, each by itself,
and their wives by themselves. 
CJB

And, as I've tried time and time again to point out, these four names are found IN THAT ORDER within Yeshua`s lineage found in Luke's account of His life:

Luke 3:23-38
23 Yeshua was about thirty years old when he began his public ministry. It was supposed that he was a son of Yosef who was of Eli, 
24 of Mattat, of Levi, of Malki, of Yannai, of Yosef, 
25 of Mattityahu, of Amotz, of Nachum, of Hesli, of Naggai, 
26 of Machat, of Mattityahu, of Shim‘i, of Yosef, of Yodah, 
27 of Yochanan, of Reisha, of Z’rubavel, of Sh’altiel, of Neri, 
28 of Malki, of Addi, of Kosam, of Elmadan, of Er, 
29 of Yeshua, of Eli‘ezer, of Yoram, of Mattat, of Levi, 
30 of Shim‘on, of Y’hudah, of Yosef, of Yonam, of Elyakim, 
31 of Mal’ah, of Manah, of Mattatah, of Natan, of David, 
32 of Yishai, of ‘Oved, of Bo‘az, of Salmon, of Nachshon, 
33 of Amminadav, of Admin, of Arni, of Hetzron, of Peretz, of Y’hudah, 
34 of Ya‘akov, of Yitz’chak, of Avraham, of Terach, of Nachor, 
35 of S’rug, of Re‘u, of Peleg, of ‘Ever, of Shelah, 
36 of Keinan, of Arpakhshad, of Shem, of Noach, of Lemekh, 
37 of Metushelach, of Hanokh, of Yered, of Mahalal’el, of Keinan, 
38 of Enosh, of Shet, of Adam, of God. 
CJB

In order for these families to mourn the Messiah as either (1) a firstborn son (if they had multiple sons) or (2) an only son (if they only had the one son), all AT THE SAME TIME, this would have to be AFTER the Resurrection! And, they would need to have immortal, incorruptible bodies to survive for a thousand years!

And, what about Yesha`yahu's prophecy?

Isaiah 65:19-20
19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
23 They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD, and their offspring with them.
24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.
25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.
KJV

The phrase "the child shall die an hundred years" means "childHOOD shall die at a hundred years"; in other words, puberty shall end when a child turns 100 years old! The verse also suggests that the sinner has not reached the "age of accountability" until he or she is 100 years old, when one who sins shall be accursed! (This may also mean that a boy's bar mitsvah and a girl's bat mitsvah might be moved correspondingly later!) And, btw, that "elect" are NOT "Christians!"

Now, when are you EVER going to realize that the reason for most sacrifices is NOT for atonement for sin?! Animal sacrifices were also for many other reasons, even as for providing food for the Levi'iym (the Levites)!

[Retrobyter]

On 11/8/2016 at 8:27 AM, Marcus O'Reillius said:

The 144,000 never leaven Jesus' side.  Rev 14:4.

Now ask yourself, would you take your bride to war for her honeymoon?
Ask yourself again: Does the LORD need billions of people to trample out His Wrath against hundreds of millions?

Jesus said the gathered wheat would be taken to the barn of Heaven, while the collected tares would be burned in the field of this world. (Mt 13)
We see that with the Great Multitude before the Father - in Heaven - before the first blood and fire Trumpet of the desolations He has decreed goes forth (Rev 7, 8)

The LORD does have an army with Him in Joel 2.
They are special, and I put it to you, that they are the sealed Firstfruits of the Harvest: the 144,000.

Shalom, Marcus.

No, but most weddings don't happen until AFTER the groom-to-be comes BACK from the war! The "wedding" doesn't happen in "Heaven!" It happens AFTER Yeshua` is victorious! Remember what Yeshua` said:

Matthew 26:27-29
27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.
KJV

Mark 14:23-25
23 And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
25 Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.
KJV

Luke 22:17-18
17 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves:
18 For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come.
KJV

However, wine was (and still is) an integral part of Hebrew weddings!

John 2:1-11
1 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:
2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.
3 And when they wanted (lacked) wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.
6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it.
9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.
11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
KJV

Second, you're forgetting the "other shoe" of war support. Yes, Yeshua`, on behalf of His Father, YHWH, COULD fight the war alone. (He's surprised [and disappointed] that He must start it alone!) BUT, He won't be alone for long.

Isaiah 63:1-7
1 Who is this that cometh from Edom, with dyed garments from Bozrah? this that is glorious in his apparel, travelling in the greatness of his strength? I that speak in righteousness, mighty to save (deliver; rescue).
2 Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel, and thy garments like him that treadeth in the winefat?
3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.
4 For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.
5 And I looked, and there was none to help; and I wondered that there was none to uphold: therefore mine own arm brought salvation (rescue) unto me; and my fury, it upheld me.
6 And I will tread down the people in mine anger, and make them drunk in my fury, and I will bring down their strength to the earth.
7 I will mention the lovingkindnesses of the LORD (Hebrew: "chacdeey YHWH" = "YAH'S deeds of covenant-keeping love"), and the praises of the LORD, according to all that the LORD hath bestowed on us, and the great goodness toward the house of Israel, which he hath bestowed on them according to his mercies, and according to the multitude of his lovingkindnesses (Hebrew: chacaadaayow = his-deeds-of-covenant-keeping-love).
KJV

HOWEVER, there is also the other side of the coin. Not everyone involved in the war is there as a warrior. Some are there as rescue parties and medical support! While Yeshua` is dealing with the enemies, our jobs will be to rescue the captives and lead them to safety and look after their injuries and perform miracles, as needed.

Third, really? Matthew 13 doesn't call the "barn" "Heaven!" What does He say in Matthew 13?

Matthew 13:41-43
41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
KJV

The "Kingdom of their Father" is NOT "Heaven!" Paul tells us how these kingdoms are related:

1 Corinthians 15:20-28
20 But now is Christ (the Messiah) risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ (in the Messiah) shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits (the "zeroeth resurrection"); afterward they that are Christ's at his coming (the first resurrection).
24 Then cometh the end (the second resurrection), when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign (during the Millennium), till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27 For he (YHWH God) hath put all things under his (the Messiah's) feet. But when he saith, all things are put under him, it is manifest (obvious) that he (YHWH God) is excepted (i.e., He is the exception), which did put all things under him (the Messiah).
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
KJV

See how this compares to Revelation:

Revelation 20:4-8; 21:1-7
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ (the Messiah) a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ (the Messiah), and shall reign with him (the Messiah) a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
... (the GWTJ goes here)
21:1 And I saw a new heaven (Greek: ouranon kainon = "a new sky") and a new earth (Greek: geen kaineen = "a new land"): for the first heaven (sky) and the first earth (ground) were passed away (Greek: apeelthan = "had gone off"); and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven (a loud voice out of the sky) saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he (YHWH God) that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
KJV

Apeelthan comes from ...

NT:565 aperchomai (ap-erkh'-om-ahee); from NT:575 and NT:2064; to go off (i.e. depart), (to go) aside (i.e. apart) or (to go) behind (i.e. follow), literally or figuratively:
KJV - come, depart, go (aside, away, back, out, ... ways), pass away, be past.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

To understand this word better, look at what Peter said!

2 Peter 3:10-12
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens (Greek: hoi ouranoi = the skies) shall pass away (Greek: pareleusontai = "shall have passed by") with a great noise (a loud noise), and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens (the skies) being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
KJV

Pareleusontai comes from ...

NT:3928 parerchomai (par-er'-khom-ahee); from NT:3844 and NT:2064; to come near or (to come) aside, i.e. to approach (arrive), (to) go by (or [to go] away), (figuratively) (to) perish or (to) neglect, (caus.) (to) avert:
KJV - come (forth), go, pass (away, by, over), past, transgress.

NT:3844 para (par-ah'); a primary preposition; properly, near; i.e. (with genitive case) from beside (literally or figuratively), (with dative case) at (or in) the vicinity of (objectively or subjectively), (with accusative case) to the proximity with (local [especially beyond or opposed to] or causal [on account of]:
KJV - above, against, among, at, before, by, contrary to,  friend, from,  give [such things as they],  that [she] had,  his, in, more than, nigh unto, (out) of, past, save, side ... by, in the sight of, than, [therefore-], with. In compounds it retains the same variety of application.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

This makes MUCH better sense if we're talking about MATERIAL "heavens" or "skies!" And, this passage is talking about the material skies - the atmosphere - racing by a stationary position! The dirt, too, flying away with the wind! This is talking about a HUGE EXPLOSION! Whether "nuclear" or not, who knows but God? BUT, it better explains what Peter  - and John - are talking about as this Fire that will rival the Flood of Genesis 7-9!

[Retrobyter]

On 11/8/2016 at 8:32 AM, Marcus O'Reillius said:

I'm sorry, I almost missed this one.

The New Jerusalem does not come down until AFTER the Millennium.
Saying that Jesus goes to the New Jerusalem 2,000 years ago is NOT supported by Scripture in John 14:1-3.

Shalom, Marcus.

This is true, the New Jerusalem does not come down until AFTER the Millennium; HOWEVER, it's not just created at that time!

Effectively, you're saying that the New Jerusalem just suddenly ... (POOF!) ... appears! And yet, it is a PHYSICAL city and it's a COLOSSAL city, one in which God took His time building for the LOVE that He has for us!

Look, you MUST understand that the New Jerusalem is a physical city, don't you? All of the materials it contains are physical materials; all of its dimensions are concrete dimensions of physical size; all of its beauty is something we'll be able to see with literal, physical eyes in our new, literal, physical super-bodies, able to BLAST (pneumatikos) air more than just BREATHE (psuchikos) air! We'll be able to touch it with our literal, physical hands and fingers, feel it with our literal, physical feet and legs as we walk! Hear its sounds of activity with our literal, physical ears! Smell the fresh air and flowers of the budding trees! Eat and taste the good variety of fruits from the Tree of Life and drink and taste the pure, clean water of the River of the Water of Life!

Gold is real, physical gold! The whole city within the walls is built with it! The STREETS are paved with it!
Jasper is real, physical jasper, the "BLOOD stone!" (It's NOT a "diamond," a hunk of hardened carbon that can burn!)
Sapphire is real, physical sapphire!
Chalcedony is real, physical chalcedony!
Emerald is real, physical emerald!
Sardonyx is real, physical sardonyx!
Sardius is real, physical sard!
Chrysolite is real, physical chrysolite!
Beryl, whichever color variety is used, is real, physical beryl!
The topaz is a real, physical topaz!
Chrysoprasus is real, physical chrysoprase!
Jacinth is a real, physical jacinth!
Amethyst is real, physical amethyst!
And, although you and others may disagree, I believe that the pearls are real, physical pearls, each one permanently rolled away from its gateway after the city lands, in commemoration of the Resurrection of Yeshua`, like the stone which was rolled away from the tomb! One doesn't get into the city except through the blood (the walls and first foundation are of jasper), and it's by the Resurrection that we have access!

The wording in verse 21 is ...

Revelation 21:21
21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
KJV

And, then we are told ...

Revelation 21:25
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
KJV

... implying that these gates will always stand open, once opened. My first thought was, "Why are there gates at all if they are never used?" Then, it finally dawned on me: pearls are generally ROUND like rocks ... or stones! Like the stone rolled away from the tomb entrance!

The biggest pearls ever found are less than 9.5 inches in length, but never underestimate the power of God! If He can make a fish large enough to swallow a full-grown man, He can make a pearl large enough to be a gate to a city of His making, whether He uses an oyster to do it or not!

However temporary, the tent that Avraham used for himself and his family was recognized by God's Word as his "house," his place of dwelling! The Scriptures call the New Jerusalem the "tent of God," like Avraham's tent! CONNECT THE DOTS! The New Jerusalem IS God's House, the same House that was called, "my Father's house" in John 14:1-3!

John 14:1-3
1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
KJV

Revelation 21:1-3
1 And I saw a new heaven (Greek: ouranon kainon = "a new sky") and a new earth (Greek: geen kaineen = "a new land"): for the first heaven (Greek: ho ... prootos ouranos = "the first sky") and the first earth (Greek: hee prootee gee = "the first land") were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle (tent) of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
KJV

And, don't forget the transitions in Hebrews:

Hebrews 11:8-10
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles (tents) with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
KJV

And, how do we know that Avraham "looked for a city which had foundations?" Well, we read this about him:

Genesis 15:1-21
1 After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.
2 And Abram said, Lord GOD, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus?
3 And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir.
4 And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir.
5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.
6 And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
7 And he said unto him, I am the LORD that brought thee out of Ur of the Chaldees, to give thee this land to inherit it.
8 And he said, Lord GOD, whereby shall I know that I shall inherit it?
9 And he said unto him, Take me an heifer of three years old, and a she goat of three years old, and a ram of three years old, and a turtledove, and a young pigeon.
10 And he took unto him all these, and divided them in the midst, and laid each piece one against another: but the birds divided he not.
11 And when the fowls came down upon the carcases, Abram drove them away.
12 And when the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell upon Abram; and, lo, an horror of great darkness fell upon him.
13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;
14 And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge: and afterward shall they come out with great substance.
15 And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age.
16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.
17 And it came to pass, that, when the sun went down, and it was dark, behold a smoking furnace, and a burning lamp that passed between those pieces.
18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,
20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims,
21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.
KJV

OT:136 'Adonay (ad-o-noy'); an emphatic form of OT:113; the Lord (used as a proper name of God only):
KJV - (my) Lord.

OT:113 'adown (aw-done'); or (shortened) 'adon (aw-done'); from an unused root (meaning to rule); sovereign, i.e. controller (human or divine):
KJV - lord, master, owner. Compare also names beginning with "Adoni-".

OT:134 'eden (eh'-den); from the same as OT:113 (in the sense of strength); a basis (of a building, a column, etc.):
KJV - foundation, socket.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

This is the first place in the Bible that the word "Adonay" is mentioned! And, it's a word that means "MY foundation Layer!" And, what does the New Jerusalem have? TWELVE foundations!

You said, "Saying that Jesus goes to the New Jerusalem 2,000 years ago is NOT supported by Scripture in John 14:1-3." I'll just say back to you, "Saying that Jesus goes to Heaven 2,000 years ago is ALSO NOT supported by Scripture in John 14:1-3!"

 

[Retrobyter]

On 11/8/2016 at 8:29 AM, Marcus O'Reillius said:

This statement of yours [7. His Kingdom during the Millennium will begin shortly (3.5 years) after His Return] is wholly a product of your eschatology.
It is not factually stated anywhere in Scripture.

Shalom, again, Marcus.

Let's go back to Daniel:

Daniel 9:24
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, (1) to finish the transgression, and (2) to make an end of sins, and (3) to make reconciliation for iniquity, and (4) to bring in everlasting righteousness, and (5) to seal up the vision and prophecy, and (6) to anoint the most Holy.
KJV

Right now, prophetically speaking, "Daniel's people and holy city" are "on a Sabbatical," so to speak, while God deals with these "times of the Gentiles" (Luke 21:24; Romans 11:25). Meanwhile, the children of Israel are suffering "the time of Jacob's trouble" (Jeremiah 30:7), because they had the AUDACITY to reject God's own Son - HIS choice of Messiah - as their King, the Messiah Yeshua`, leaving them "desolate!" (Matthew 23:38) The last Seven of this prophecy was split in half BECAUSE of this very action! And so, we await AFTER these "times of the Gentiles" to finish for the rest of the Seven to be completed. It takes time to wage a war, especially when neighboring countries get involved, as they are predicted to do! Yeshua` will be back as the CONQUERING AND VICTORIOUS Messiah, who will become "the KING of Kings and LORD of Lords," a "World Emperor!"

Just my eschatology? I really don't think so.

 

Edited November 11, 2016 by Retrobyter
to add a line

[Retrobyter]

2 hours ago, inchrist said:

Sorry but yourself and Marcus are incorrect here.

This really does not fit concerning new Jerusalem who is the bride of Christ in jewish weddings.

The couple spent seven days under the chupah, or literally in the chamber. 

After those seven days the two emerged from the chupah to present themselves, the groom and bride bedecked in all their wedding finery:


Yeshayah (Isaiah) 61:10 - 62:5 I delight greatly in HaShem; my soul rejoices in my God. For he has clothed me with garments of salvation and arrayed me in a robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom adorns his head like a priest, and as a bride adorns herself with her jewels. For as the soil makes the sprout come up and a garden causes seeds to grow, so the Sovereign HaShem will make righteousness and praise spring up before all nations. For Zion’s sake I will not keep silent, for Jerusalem’s sake I will not remain quiet, till her righteousness shines out like the dawn, her salvation like a blazing torch. The nations will see your righteousness, and all kings your glory; you will be called by a new name that the mouth of HaShem will bestow. You will be a crown of splendor in HaShem’s hand, a royal diadem in the hand of your God. No longer will they call you Deserted, or name your land Desolate. But you will be called Hephzibah, and your land Beulah; for HaShem will take delight in you, and your land will be married. As a young man marries a maiden, so will your sons marry you; as a bridegroom rejoices over his bride, so will your God rejoice over you.

Pictures Rev 21:2

Rev 21:2  I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.

After presenting themselves the bride and groom begin the actual wedding feast.

So the Bride presents herself with the groom bedecked in all their wedding finery after the 7 day chupah to the whole world BEFORE the wedding feast.

The wedding feast nor the presenting of the groom and bride occur after the millennium. Rev 21.2 is not post millennium

 

Shabbat shalom, inchrist.

Fooey! Have you even SEEN a Jewish wedding? The "chupah" (and the "ch" is like a gutteral "h" sound, as in the Scottish word "loch") is a CANOPY under which the wedding occurs! It's not a "room"; it's a flat "TENT!" And, it's often built from a taliyt with poles tied at the tassels or "tsittsit!" "Seven days"?! Nope.

Now, they may remain in isolation in rooms for seven days (optional, these days), but they are NOT under the "chupah" all that time! They come out of their rooms and are JOINED under the "chupah." A "chupah" is a COVERING, and for the children of Israel in the wilderness, it was the cloud over them that shielded them from the blistering sun, the pillar of cloud and fire at the head leading them, as they traveled from Mitsraiym (Egypt) to the "Promised Land," that is, the Land that was Promised to Avraham and his heirs. The "chupah" is a symbol of the wish for GOD'S PROTECTION over the union!

OT:2646 chuppah (khoop-paw'); from OT:2645; a canopy:
KJV - chamber, closet, defence.

OT:2645 chaphah (khaw-faw'); a primitive root (compare OT:2644, OT:2653); to cover; by implication, to veil, to encase, protect:
KJV - ceil (from which we get our word "ceiling"), cover, overlay.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

Now, "chuppah" or "chupah" may have been badly translated into "chamber" and "closet" in Psalm 19:5 and Joel 2:16, but that's not what the word means. It was probably so translated as a room that was "ceiled," that is, a room with a "ceiling," but that's not the same thing as that which is used in weddings. See, the translators of the KJV had apparently never attended a Jewish wedding, either!

The word was more properly translated in Isaiah 4:5:

Isaiah 4:4-6
4 When the LORD shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning.
5 And the LORD will create upon every dwelling place of mount Zion, and upon her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day, and the shining of a flaming fire by night: for upon all the glory shall be a defence.
6 And there shall be a tabernacle for a shadow in the daytime from the heat, and for a place of refuge, and for a covert from storm and from rain.
KJV

Isaiah 4:4-6
4 When Adonai washes away the filth of the women of Tziyon and cleanses Yerushalayim from the blood shed in it with a blast of searing judgment, 5 Adonai will create over the whole site of Mount Tziyon and over those who assemble there a smoking cloud by day and a shining, flaming fire by night; for the Glory will be over everything like a hupah. 6 A sukkah will give shade by day from the heat; it will also provide refuge and cover from storm and rain. 
CJB

Isaiah 4:4-6
4 The Lord will wash away the filth of the women of Zion; he will cleanse the bloodstains from Jerusalem by a spirit of judgment and a spirit of fire. 5 Then the Lord will create over all of Mount Zion and over those who assemble there a cloud of smoke by day and a glow of flaming fire by night; over all the glory will be a canopy. 6 It will be a shelter and shade from the heat of the day, and a refuge and hiding place from the storm and rain. 
NIV

I list these three versions because they each contribute to the right meaning of these verses. The KJV shows us that the word does NOT primarily mean a "chamber" or a "closet." The CJB gives us the right use of the word "hupah" or "chupah" (as well as the correct pronunciations of the names). It also gives us the fact that "sukkah" (plural is "sukkot," as in the holiday) was used in verse 6. And, the NIV shows the LINKAGE between verses 5 and 6; the thoughts are not separate. Rather, this "chupah" of cloud IS the shelter (sukkah) and shade.

Now, you have the right timing for Yesha`yahu's prophecy in Isaiah 61:10-62:5, but not for the right reasons. I won't repeat the quote of these verses, but notice the highlighted portions that I have bold-faced. This is about the RESCUE of the children of Israel at the Messiah Yeshua`s coming! It's about their DELIVERANCE! That is NOT the word "salvation" as we understand it in Christian circles today, that is, the justification of an individual by God. The deliverance of the children of Israel by God's Messiah, Yeshua`, is what these verses mean! They are going to become famous worldwide for what God does for them in this most miraculous rescue!

(Now, I know that you know what it means, but as a side note for others reading along, "HaShem" is Hebrew for "The Name" and refers to the "Tetragrammaton," the "Four Letters," that are the actual Name of God revealed to Moses. It may be transliterated into English as "YHVH" or "YHWH." It's translated as "the LORD" or as "GOD" or as "JEHOVAH," all three in all caps in the OT of the KJV.)

The four names of interest mentioned in this passage are:
1. Deserted (Forsaken) = `Azuwvaah = "empty-of-inhabitants"
2. Desolate = Shmaamaah = "devastated" or "ruined"
3. Hephzibah = Cheftsiy Baah = "my-pleasure (is) in-her"
4. Beulah = B`uwlaah = "married" or "mastered" or "owned"

OT:5805 `azuwbaah (az-oo-baw'); feminine passive participle of OT:5800; desertion (of inhabitants):
KJV - forsaking.

OT:5800 `aazab (aw-zab'); a primitive root; to loosen, i.e. relinquish, permit, etc.:
KJV - commitself, fail, forsake, fortify, help, leave (destitute, off), refuse,  surely.

OT:8077 shemaamaah (shem-aw-maw'); or shimamaah (shee-mam-aw'); feminine of OT:8076; devastation; figuratively, astonishment:
KJV - (laid,  most) desolate (-ion), waste.

OT:8076 shaameem (shaw-mame'); from OT:8074; ruined:
KJV - desolate.

OT:2657 Chephtsiy baah (khef-tsee'baw); from OT:2656 with suffixes; my delight (is) in her; Cheptsi-bah, a fanciful name for Palestine:
KJV - Hephzi-bah.

OT:2656 cheephets (khay'-fets); from OT:2654; pleasure; hence (abstractly) desire; concretely, a valuable thing; hence (by extension) a matter (as something in mind):
KJV - acceptable, delight (-some), desire, things desired, matter, pleasant (-ure), purpose, willingly.

OT:2654 chaapheets (khaw-fates'); a primitive root; properly, to incline to; by implication (literally but rarely) to bend; figuratively, to be pleased with, desire:
KJV -  any at all, (have, take) delight, desire, favour, like, move, be (well) pleased, have pleasure, will, would.

OT:1167 ba`al (bah'-al); from OT:1166 (OT:1168?); a master; hence, a husband, or (figuratively) owner (often used with another noun in modifications of this latter sense):
KJV -  archer, babbler, bird, captain, chief man, confederate, have to do, dreamer, those to whom it is due, furious, those that are given to it, great, hairy, he that hath it, have, horseman, husband, lord, man, married, master, person, sworn, they of.

OT:1166 baa`al (baw-al'); a primitive root; to be master; hence, (as denominative from OT:1167) to marry:
KJV - have dominion (over), be husband, marry (-ried,  wife).

OT:1168 Ba`al (bah'-al); the same as OT:1167; Baal, a Phoenician deity: -Baal, (plural) Baalim.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

ALL of these are talking about the LAND! Indeed, that fact is revealed in verses 4 and 5!

Finally, Revelation 21:1-2 IMMEDIATELY FOLLOW Revelation 20! There were no chapter divisions in the original text! (Indeed, there weren't even verse divisions!)

One should read, 

Revelation 20:7-21:3
And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
KJV

There's nothing to suggest that this narrative breaks in any way. It was a mere, uninspired CHOICE of the translator, Robert Estienne (Robert Stephanus), to put the chapter division in where he did sometime in 1551 A.D. It makes sense to put it where he did, separating the old from the new, but the original text did not. So, when you said, "Rev 21.2 is not post millennium," that's not right!

Note here, too, that it's the CITY that is described "as a bride adorned for her husband," not the people within the city! Indeed, at this point, there AREN'T ANY people within it! Later, John said,

Revelation 21:9-11
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; ...
KJV

In verse 2, using the word "as," he uses a simile to describe the city as a bride. In verse 9, he uses a metaphor to describe the city as the bride. When one of the seven messengers who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues showed him the "bride," he showed him the CITY, not the people!