Legalism

[brakelite]

33 minutes ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

I believe I said in my previous post that obedience and striving to keep the law were great things.

I don't believe I have ever suggested that we "strive to keep the law".  I have always maintained that any law-keeping comes from, or is the fruit of, our relationship with Jesus...they are never born of a desire to be saved, that miracle has already been accomplished on our behalf by the shed blood of our Redeemer.  It is the constant misconstruing of motives that appears to me to reveal a deep antipathy against the Sabbath...a reflection in fact of the same antipathy exhibited by Satan throughout history. The disparaging remarks concerning legalism and the demand that modern Christians, in order to keep the Sabbath must start sacrificing animals in the temple, is simply blind bigotry and ignorance.

There are two parables regarding the bride which are yet to be completed. In one, the bridegroom is waiting for His bride, and in the second, the bride is waiting for the Groom. The problem the bride has continually had is her unwillingness to wear the wedding garment provided. This wedding garment represents the righteousness of Christ. That righteousness we accept by faith, through surrender to the Holy Spirit who then imparts to us the the character of Christ and we become partakers of the divine nature. We are changed into the image of the Son of God...into the image of the Groom. This does not happen overnight, however, abiding in the vine must produce fruit, and the foremost of those fruit is love for God which itself motivates the believer to obedience and surrender to the authority of God. Jesus informed His arch enemy that we are to live not by bread alone, but by every word of God. Are we to add a caveat to that counsel that only 9 of the 'words' of God apply to Christians, the 4th one to the Jews?
We are not to fashion our own garment, nor mix and match with what is offered. It is Christ's righteousness or none. Nothing less will do. David rightly said under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit that all the commandments of God are righteousness.  Remember the man thrown out for not being dressed appropriately? Do not accept a counterfeit garment. Christ's righteousness is perfect, sinless, law-abiding, holy, just, merciful, gracious, and faithful. It is, in short, His own character. The more we surrender, the more He will work in us to will and to do His good pleasure. Remember what His good pleasure was? Psalms 40:8  I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.....Isaiah 42:21  The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness’ sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable. If through close connection with our Lord and Saviour Jesus, that is His Spirit abiding within,how can we not in time, imitate His own character making His life our own? This is impossible through 'striving'.
So in conclusion, how do we stop sinning? Or how do we obey? Surrender. Surrender. Every day. Every thing.

Of course many will disagree with what I have written above. Others may even claim I am lying and that I don't believe any of it and that I am deliberately misleading people. That the above is not what I truly believe but I am simply saying that in an attempt to 'sound orthodox". What they cannot deny however is the Biblical basis for what I have stated.

[Blood Bought 1953]

Thanks , Cobalt for letting me know what we are dealing with.

[Rut-Ro]

On 1/22/2018 at 5:24 PM, simplejeff said:

So ?  If sin HAS DOMINION over you,  the penalty is death.  If you sin, and don't repent, the penalty is death. 

You believe that applies for the Christian? 

[Blood Bought 1953]

 

I believe I said in my previous post that obedience and striving to keep the law were great things.

 

I think you read too much into my use of the word  “striving”. I was not trying to accuse or make any type of point with that word——- I just as easily could have used the word “ desiring ..... the point was that there certainly nothing wrong with trying to obey the Law——- unless that is being used instead of faith for ones Justification.

[Rut-Ro]

On 1/22/2018 at 5:33 PM, simplejeff said:

Christians can still sin,  and as you oppose Scripture,  that is the case as demonstrated by your posts.  Hopefully you are under grace,  and will not continue sinning, so as not to suffer penalties of any kind.  (sinning has consequences even for persons under grace,  just like running a red light has consequences when someone comes sideways and runs into you, even if you had diplomatic immunity from the law) .....  i.e. as long as you think it is okay to willingly disobey God,  there will be consequences.

I've ventured to a number of Christian forums over the years. Inevitably there is a group or one in each forum who seeks to teach contrary to the good news Jesus died to deliver. And all while assuming a self-righteous profile in the process. 
You will never have a right to judge my faith. You don't realize as you judge so too are you judged. Wanting. You have not a clue. And that can be an eternal shame. 

Galatians 2:21 I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose.

 

[Blood Bought 1953]

Paul said we have the right to judge......we are to judge fellow Christians.....we are not permitted to judge the world.

[brakelite]

1 hour ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

I believe I said in my previous post that obedience and striving to keep the law were great things.

 

I think you read too much into my use of the word  “striving”. I was not trying to accuse or make any type of point with that word——- I just as easily could have used the word “ desiring ..... the point was that there certainly nothing wrong with trying to obey the Law——- unless that is being used instead of faith for ones Justification.

Fair enough. Have you in any of my writings discerned any suggestion that I seek to obey God's commandments in order to be saved, or even remain saved? If I have, I apologise. It is our connection to Christ that ensures our ultimate salvation...and the works we do, whether in obedience or not, cannot be accomplished on our own because as Jesus said, "without Me ye can do nothing". 

Yet overcoming sin and obedience to God's commandments cannot be separated. But both are fruit of our connection to Christ. The law will always be the standard in the judgement...we are judged by our works...so if our connection to the Vine is wonky,so also will be our obedience....the law cannot save us, but it most assuredly will condemn us if we are not in Christ, and it is our relation to the law which is a direct reflection to the health and state of our relation to Jesus. Let me put it another way. David said, Psalm 119:11 Thy word have I hid in my heart, that I might not sin against thee. When we read John 1:1-3 we recognise that the Son of God is the Word of God, and by His Spirit He abides in our hearts. Thus is our ONLY means by which to overcome sin. By having the Living God residing in us. Walking with Him,communing with Him daily, "an ever present help in time of need". My friend,is this legalism? Is this salvation by works? Don't listen to anyone else's opinion of who I am and what I represent...take it from the horse's mouth.

[Your closest friendnt]

2 hours ago, Rut-Ro said:

You believe that applies for the Christian? 

It's good that you asked this question. 

In the OT the Israelites were under the righteousness of the Law. 

Let's say that an Israelite in good standing to the righteousness of the Law, if he disobey the Sabath, he was not alive to the righteousness of the Law, he was cut off, and was not allowed to continiun or be part of the culture. He was dead to the righteousness of the Law, he did not have the life the obedience to the Law gives, favor with God, he had death . 

For this sin he was exocuminicate, and for other sins, like not keeping the uleaven bread ordinance. 

There was not sacrifice for these disobedience, and they would have to wait for the next year to be part of the "culture". And be part of the righteousness and the favor of been obedient to the law. 

For other sins they had sacrifices and rituals for reconciliation. 

A leper being unclean could not be part and participate in the coulture. 

The people had the life and the righteousness of the law and never the life and righteousness of their Lord. 

That's why to enter trough the gates it was death for them. The did not have the life of their lord. 

Today we have not only the life of our Lord Jesus Christ, but also his life remain in us. 

That's why we call it eternal life. 

As long as Jesus has the Life so do we. 

If we sin we still remain in the Life, because Jesus did not sin. 

As he is so we are. 

And because Jesus has already died and has been raised from the dead and he is sitted on the Throne forever the Judge of all, and we are under his blood and partakers of his spirit. 

Jesus can not undone his death, he still died for the obedient believers and for the disobedient believers. 

We are his children. 

If we are disobedient we are still his children. 

He Jesus Christ made it that way, so we are free from the fear of death and eternal punishment. 

That does not mean that we are free from his disipline, and or the devil, because as his children we are here on earth and we can still have fellowship sometimes with him, and some time with the darkness, or love the world to much, or forget about him. 

Those who have rejected him and refuse to believe in him , that he is the Christ, the Savior of the world, the only Mediator between Man and God, and live a good and righteous life even better than the most devoted Christians do, do you think the Devil will tell Jesus: You can have them, they refuse to do my will, I don't want good people in my flock, they have refuse my fellowship. 

Jesus will say : no they are not mined even if they are disobedient to you, they still have death in them and they are not under my blood and they do not have my life or of my spirit. 

He will say to the Devil, you can keep those of your own who are disobedient to you but they delight in keeping my commandments, and i will keep those who are mine and are disobedient to me. (not in totality, each to his own mesurre).

Because they are under my blood and my life, even thought they delight to fellowship more with the darkness than the light. 

When the time came I went to gather the lost sheep, who lived far from .my fellowship. 

When the other one who returned, I wellcome him and showed everyone that when he  was with me, or later when he was with the world, he was always mine. 

He loved the world, and he respond to the call of the world, but he was all the time mine. 

He new that he was mine even if he did not follow my voice, and my commandments. 

And I knew all they time that he was mine, even if the people believe that he was not mine, because he is not recognizable as one of my own. 

And he may even himself believe that he is not mine when he looks in the mirror, but I know that he is mine and I am the supreme Judge. 

[Heleadethme]

22 hours ago, brakelite said:

Why is it that Christians today are so averse to obedience? What is it about the commandments of the God they profess to love, that makes the commandments so odious? The apostle John didn’t have a problem with obedience. He said the commandments are not grievous.

 

21 hours ago, Justin Adams said:

Truth is, we all know the answer to that question. Yahweh looks into the heart of the believer - I do hope He is not disappointed.

Although the Blood on the Mercy Seat atones for our sin, our lives will reflect our obedience or otherwise.

His commandments are a delight.....isn't that what the word says?

One thing I know of a certain as it was shown to me by the Lord......is that SDA is full of filth and abominable things.  I don't really know the origin of the uncleanness, the Lord has not shown that to me.....however the bottom line is the bottom line and even now I am discerning the uncleanness.  Have no part with it, take no part with it, do not be unequally yoked to it or any of it's teachings or its aherents.......whatsoever.  It is not founded on Christ.  It is a cult and idol, and like a cult they mouth their party line, which even when they quote very words of scripture it is not founded on the Author of the scripture.  Receive it not.  Dear heavenly Father,  how I pray the Lord exposes the uncleanness of this organization, and that her captives will flee out of her and receive not of her plagues.

[TheMatrixHasU71]

http://www.jesusisprecious.org/false_religion/sda/works_salvation.htm

 

Ellen White is sadly burning in the very place of Hell that she denied exists. Miss White taught a false plan of salvation of partial faith in Christ plus works. Although she claimed that salvation was by faith alone, through grace alone, in Christ alone, she also employed double-speak, as do all false prophets. According to Miss White, to be saved requires much more than just faith in Jesus Christ; but rather, she states on page 136 of “The Mount Of Blessing”...

“But the way to life is narrow and the entrance strait. If you cling to any besetting sin you will find the way too narrow for you to enter. Your own ways, your own will, your evil habits and practices, must be given up if you would keep the way of the Lord. ...” [emphasis added]

SOURCE: The Mount Of Blessing; Ellen G. White; chapter 6, page 136.

Clearly, Ellen White is requiring giving up one's sinful will, ways, habits and practices to be saved. The Bible is plainly speaking about going to Heaven in this Scripture passage. Matthew 7:13-14, “Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.” Miss White stipulates that no one can find life in Christ unless they give up their will, sinful ways, evil habits and ungodly practices. This is a works-based Gospel, which is “ANOTHER GOSPEL” (2nd Corinthians 11:3-4). This is NOT “the simplicity that is in Christ” (2nd Corinthians 11:3).

 

@Brakelite No one is averse to obedience, we all want to do our best to obey but what too many legalists just cannot seem to "get" is that we are not saved by our 'obedience'. Nor can we be perfectly obedient

 

Wake up already, we are telling you this for your own good, stop drinking the kool aid. It may taste good to you but its going to kill you