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Right it might not be a salvation issue, but it could make perseverance difficult and it could be beneficial to prepare your Spirit in the event there is no rapture by reading through the Bible again to clarify and confirm opinions that you have formed and decided are right. I do think your response does reflect a very careless study of scripture. It is as if you don't really think you need to study scripture. If there is a tribulation coming, you might wish you had invested more time in your own scriptural study so that everything doesn't become confusing and you are left searching for a opinion to depend on the way you had before because the Bible is a long book. It is not something you can start reading during an earthquake and expect to finish. I am concerned that your opinions often reflect popular opinion rather than a personal pursuit of understanding of His word. The rapture is not a safety net and an excuse to be careless in our study is it?

Lol, like it would be ridiculous no matter who said it, but especially when SS says it right? Is that really necessary or relevant to the conversation for someone such as yourself to say. Tell me Ezra, if you believe in the Holy Spirit, why don't you show more fruit? I'm confused. I just don't believe you can bully me into thinking you have more understanding, or that you have made a very convincing case that I should agree with your assessment of SS solely based on your consistent sour attitude. If you would like to be more persuasive, try being more compassionate. This is always what I loved about the prophets. I love literature and the prophets are some of my favorite writers. Their writing are beautiful, strong, sensitive, poetic. They can say the strongest rebuke in the most beautiful way. They are just effervescent and enchanting. I imagine how close they were to Him, and what the strongest word they are given to share with the people meant to them personally. Jeremiah shares his lamentation over the strong words He was given without shame. They break his heart. He doesn't just carelessly say, "well God told me to and they deserved it. I did nothing wrong," in arrogance. I spend much time reading prophets. I do not often, if ever, find the common defense for saying things with such callousness like you are doing as though you were doing someone a favor with your "strong words". I do not believe I have ever seen such responses like this ever reflect the beauty or the power of comparable messages of rebuke found in scripture. "Not many of you should become teachers, my fellow believers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly." (James 3:1). And... SS made a valid point earlier in regard to the position those who ascribe to pretrib rapture theory will be in if you are wrong. Have you considered how this will affect your faith if you are wrong?

Well here's the thing. I'm not going to say I understand everything your going through, I don't, and I'm sorry you've had so much happen to you. Bad things happen I'm afraid, and yes you were hurt, but we live in a fallen world. God doesn't want those bad things to happen, but in order to allow free choice they do. The solution is not to run from God, nor is it to continue to sin. God wants to help you-but He can't if you won't let Him. I understand anger, but moreover so does God. Instead if fighting God, take your anger to God. He is the only way you can move past what your going through, and Hes willing to take your anger, and your pain, and He wants to be there for you. God never promised an easy life, but He did promise to be there for you every step of the way, and to help you in your hour of need, if you only let Him.

Hi. I have been a member at Worthy for almost 9 years. In this time, I have had some dear pm friends that I developed some close friendships with. But then I would have my bad days and vent too much. I guess I eventually chased them away or they grew weary of me. But I say this (unbiased)...I believe that I spent countless hours trying to minister to them even when it was so rough on me physically. And I honestly think I wrote more positive pms than the ones that pushed their buttons. Some were so upset with me that they blocked me or asked me to no longer write them. I miss them. ( If they see this post, I just hope they believe that. I also hope it is not wrong to pray they one day will help me feel forgiven by them and refer to me as a sister, as they once did...on the open forum. Even if they no longer wish to pm with me.) Heartfelt blessings go out to you. You know who you are. Speaking of blessings, I am posting here to see if anyone else has encountered my problem. I seem to have a knack for rubbing others the wrong way. I try to be a kind person and have posted encouraging things many a time over the years. But when my chronic illnesses got in the way, I was simply unable to keep it up. That was my physical hindrance, though in my heart I still wanted to... God knows this is true. Sorry this is long, btw. But if anyone else has gone through the experience of ( for some reason ) people just not taking to you or abruptly exiting your life after years of corresponding or typically totally ignoring your posts ( as in zero replies, lately. In the past, a barrage of critical/gruff ones ), please share how you handled it. Is it a sin to just want someone to be friendly and feel like part of the gang here? I apologize to all I have offended. I truly don't want to rub folks the wrong way! In fact, I want to be a blessing. I can handle suggestions of what I am doing wrong to repel people. I want to be the best Christian I can. Not a people please, but a God pleaser, first and foremost. But it would be nice to be able to get along better with others too. Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Hello TJ, and thank you for being brave to be honest , and open to your pain, we feel your pain and wish that it would not hurt, but as Patriot stated, we do live in a fallen world and we cannot nor any one to condone a direct violation, or abomination to God, so the answer is No, from the scriptures it tells us this in three areas, what will not inherit the kingdom, of God, so from what you have gone through and are dealing with today , and the now, in your life, you need, to do this , if you really want to stay in the favor, of the eyes, of God, you need to forgive, ? period, you have to take that step in faith and surrender your self and cry out to God to help you , and read His word , seek Him with all that you are and with all that you have , and then when you have Gone to God for strength and power, then you will have to learn to forgive, all that people that hurt you , and , then you need to forgive your self , of everything you are feeling and with hate and anger and pain, you need to let it go , when you learn to forgive, God will show you how to love, its a beautiful circle, that only God , can provide, . we can pray for you and we will., but you have to willingly , go to god, and cry out to Him, go to the feet of Jesus , and tell Him all that you need too, if you seek Him he will be able to be found, but it must be in spirit and in truth , for God knows your pain and what you and me and everyone deals with , and so He sent His son, to the cross, to save you and me and to forgive you , and forgive, me ! He gives us peace and rest for our souls, rest in Him is like no other , don't run away from God ?, But, run to Him. our God is a God of love Holiness and compassion, , the passion of the Christ, tells it all, and so the world we live in, is of evil and wickedness, and pain and sorrow, and satan the devil runs this world , but we are to call out to God of the heavens, and if we believe and have faith to call on Him. He is faithful and just to forgive us, and to build us up, we cannot do it on our own, and no one can , do what God can for you , but you have that free will and choice, , so chose today whom you will serve, for salvation is at the door, but you have to open the door, , and let Jesus give you peace, and love, that no one can give, ..amen we will pray for you blessings sister, and peace to you

It makes me sad to see this myth perpetuated in the hearing of the sheep. This teaching is so very like that of the mainstream Jews at the time of the First Coming, who fervently believed that the Messiah was going to come to fulfill their fondest hopes of defeating the Romans, establishing the Messianic Kingdom, and exalting all the Jews, who would have the nations come to bow at their feet. Pre-tribbers are likewise going to see all of their fervent beliefs about their fondest wishes being fulfilled -- no tribulation, no suffering, no hearts filled with fear, just outta here -- dashed.

I have a question, why is everything you oppose, is about a conspiracy ?

Error begets error. Let the scriptures speak plainly. Now we request you, brethren, with regard to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, that you not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come. Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3 What does this passage plainly reveal? We are gathered together to Christ at His coming. Christ's coming and our gathering to Him happen on the day of the Lord. That event will not happen until after the apostasy and revealing of the man of sin. Our gathering to Him at His coming is clearly stated in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive. But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming. These verses show that the rapture is on the day of the Lord which is at His coming. Your "carefully understood explanation" fails because you do not distinguish between "the day of the Lord", "the tribulation period", and "God's wrath". Since the foundation isn't square, neither will the rest of the building be.

And this is something that would not come out of the mouth of a mature Christian when handling the Word of life. This is kindergarten talk.

Your kind of undone in all this... you see we all have been where you have been but you have not been where we are

okay Ezra, I see you have a problem that I have brought the truth which you are not able to handle, and so you are now calling me out to see if I need to resite what you think I don't know, or to see if I am a imposter, to the faith , that is so funny and , really , that was not nice, at all my brother.? I asked you with our differences would you call me a brother in the lord, you fail to answer, I told you ,if you consider your self a teacher of the word, you tell me none of my business, but you ask me in open, if I know God , or follow anything you believe is the word of God, ? my answer is No,? and you say I knew it, ...for what I have said, and taught of the love of God ,and of the scriptures, is not what you believe, and my God, is a awesome God, and I call Him yahuwa ? and Yahweh ? my savior, and son of God Jesus I call Yahushua , I am not jewish , Hebrew, or a jw that you told everyone I was, shame on you ? I am sinnersaved, and that should speak for it self,? I am not here to deal with anything of disagreements or , peoples power to try to prove them selves above others, I am a sinner saved by grace, and I like it that way , and in the bible, My God tells me to be humble myself, love one another, and to correct any that has taken the lords, name in vain, to correct the error of another, and put to a open shame, so that the glory of the Lord our God, is glorified in all that we do and what we say , I have , seen , the love of God in many ways, and it is beautiful and captivating, I have seen the worst of the worst, and I have seen evil destroyed , by grace, I am able to listen to you and see that you are not confident in the religion you hold ,and for that you must, try to hate and ridicue another when someone ids not agreeing in your belief , I do not hold any hate or contempt, for you , I can only feel sorry for you , that the words of God and scripture be held high, in holiness and handled with care , and you toss it around, as if it holds no power, but to your self, and your ideas, I will not further your , questions as they are to try to make me look bad, but yet, your words have clearly shown what you are doing, and what is your motive, so , I will not answer any more of your questions, for the preaching of the cross according to the bible I read is for those ,that have a ear to hear what the spirit says ,to the salvation of souls , and for those that reject and are not discerned with the righteousness of god, it is the judgment of their own souls , by there own words, we cannot ever know who is going to be saved or not, but God knows, and He judges all, for every word and thought , will be accounted for , and so we must make every effort to be in the graces of God, for He alone, teaches us, right from wrong, and so there is nothing different under the sun, we all need Jesus , and we need to be vigilant , and humble , and not proud. peace...

Turtle I have dealt with similar troubles, sometimes people will ignore us sometimes they may even be offended or upset by us and not always because we said something wrong even Jesus's words upset people. Your heart is clearly in the right place and i know you have been a true blessing to many ppl just from you sharing your heart in this post here, however you reach ppl's hearts even if that is by pm I would encourage you to continue to do so because even helping one soul causes the greatest and loudest applause in heaven. Simply by being there for others for being a shoulder they can cry on for giving an ear to listen that alone does far more than you know and one day when you are home you will understand what I am talking about you will see how vital your actions were even if it seemed small in your eyes you will see how vast of an effect it made. the world needs children like you God specifically gives his children the heart to encourage to build to uplift because he knows more than anyone how it is needed. a simple act of being there for someone of encouraging them of helping them in their time of need can save a soul. Even if ppl end up ignoring you don't give up and don't stop following your heart because it's clear God has been guiding your heart and you have been following it. Just know that no matter if ppl ignore you or react in a bad way that doesn't mean you messed up or didn't reach their hearts because a lot of times ppl change in time and tend to look back on encouragement and advice given in the past. many times our actions don't show fruit until later in the future

if you want to classify your self with a group that believes in what you believe, is what I would say is wrong, ? you separate and divide, from a stand point of view, I said, that there is a difference, of believing the word of God and not believing the word of God, so a disagreement is not , about who is wrong and who is right ? in fact, I am warning all people , if you believe or not , pre trib, mid , or post trib, we are all in the same boat, ? it is the warnings we are given from God in the bible, it tells us about the watchman, it tells us about being alert, and watching, it tells us to them that endure until the end , do you know what this means ? it is serious, and it claims, that many will not endure until the end !! and why is that, for they were not prepared for people told them not to prepare for there will be no tribulation to deal with ???? do you see, it, ? sister, I have no , agenda, and I don't have no gain in what I say , it is all about God and only about God, it is not about my feelings or your feelings or, anything else, that people have a hard time, to hear ,listen or to understand , we have come to a place, in this life, and if someone hurts some ones feelings, that will take, importance over the message , it is not good, at all, we have become, laxed in our thinking and actions, and that is a fact , the more we learn and see what is going on the more I see a disconnect, and that is amazing ? I never ever thought I would see this, and how people act today as if , life just goes on, and not a care in the world , but I can say that, I have tried and I will continue to try to bring scripture and Gods word to the table, for it is what we are , to do , in our service, to God , that we be living sacrifices for Him for we are not of our selves, we have been bought with a high price , and we are now bond servants to our God the most high , and we are to do what is His will and not continue to live our lives for our selves, for we must deny the self , and pick up our cross, and this means, we follow as the shepherd has done, and picking up our cross, does not mean what many take lightly ? would you agree ? thank you and blessings

Are you a female? And you want a female girlfriend just to have as a friend or to be intimate with? No,it is not ok to get involved with a lesbian. The Bible is very explicit that we are not to have sexual relationships with the same sex gender. It is a sin. Only a male and female relationship is accepted by God.

No my sister, it does not make sense,? it is wishful thinking and deception at its finest, remember the scripture, if it were possible to fool even the elect ? we cannot base our hope, on this at all, and its for the simple reasons given over and over, and as said, if people put there trust in God, to take them out of here before the tribulation, ? and the tribulation happens and you are subjected to go through it , then you will reject God, for letting you down, and think He has broken, His word which was never given, for a false hope,? it is better to be prepared and ready to go into the storm , then to say the storm is not coming ? do you see what this belief of a lie ,can do to people, people lives are at stake here, SOULS left in the balance ? to just say something you are not understanding , or cannot prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt.,? now what I have said is common sense, and its time to be ready, for survival., for I see we are in a disagreement , and are following two different Gods in the bible, ? the God , name Jesus tells us in matthew 24 that if , we that follow Him, Jesus that we will be hated persecuted and killed, , is your God telling you we , do not see tribulation, and no harm comes to you , just believe and you will escape ? can you see what that sounds like, I would stick to the scriptures my sister, and not , bet on what is a losing bet, with lives, , satan has infiltrated the best, and so , doctrine that is not clear, but yet, is pushed as a assumption on some ones part is the same, as teaching something that is not true ,? we need to search the scriptures, and see Gods heart in this, do you think , that if God went to the cross, we are not going to see death persecution or pain, ? if you see that we are reading to different bibles, and have gone down two different roads, ? I say this in love, and do not want any to be mislead, , but the truth be told, in fact , not only is what you stated , false, but it can be counted as a conspiracy, ? blessings and peace

Abortion is indeed a criminal act and technically it is a form of murder. However, we also have to examine what the abortion lobby is really all about. As well as being just another form of homicide, we have to examine it from Biblical, sociological and spiritual aspects. I think that we can judge the act with regard to three major points. 1/ It encourages promiscuity and lawlessness. Abortion is often used as a form of contraception, and not only does it encourage the sin of fornication, but it is also a way that people can avoid accountability and avoid taking responsibility for their own actions. There are consequences of promiscuity and one of them is unwanted pregnancies. 2/ It is being used as a political tool to destroy family values and also as a forerunner to mass population control. 3/ In some cases abortion can also be seen as a covert form of human blood sacrifice. Satan loves it when innocent people are murdered. Satan loves abortion. The question of abortion comes down to much more than homicide. When encouraged and promoted by the Government and the Media or by organisations such as 'Planned Parenthood' then it is easy to see that it is part of a much more sinister agenda.

I have a counselor in childhood sexual abuse, a psychiatrist, a psychologist, a community mental health crisis team due to 8 suicide Attempts and self harming, I have a crisis team a good Dr and police are now involved, as they stopped attempt 8 from working and debt me to hospital who sent me home. I really like this girl more than I've liked a guy I know God frowns upon it but he allowed my stepfather to sexually abuse me when I was young. Sorry if this offends you just angry at God at the moment and police interviews are bringing memories back xx

The Bible has strong words dealing with homosexuality... And none of them good, it would be better to remain single. Though, I suspect the root of the problem here isn't being a lesbian or not...I suspect it's time you dealt with your childhood drama, whatever it might be, have you considered a food christian counselor?

There's a girl I really like and I have no trust in men due to childhood trauma. Would God understand if I had a girlfriend instead because otherwise I will be alone forever as I cannot get close to a man.

......

And that last little phrase -- "and the great tribulation" -- you just slip in as though you had proved it. The Great Presumption of pre-tribbers: that the Wrath of God is the same as the Great Tribulation. Not a single verse in scripture supports this doctrine of pre-trib, but you all just say it as if it was a proven fact anyway.

Most new believers have never heard of a pre, mid, pre wrath, 7th Seal, 7th Trumpet or Post Rapture Doctrines. So this doctrine in not a Salvation issue. They believe that once they were lost, and now they are Saved. Jesus Christ saved them. If one thinks the Rapture is a Salvation issue, then your Salvation is Works related, and a false belief in all aspects. In Christ Montana Marv

Luk 23:34 Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do

That's a classic symptom of abuse. And I know that you mean what you say. There is nothing wrong with sleeping with another girl in a nonsexual way to feel safe, provided she has the same attitude. I don't think God expects you to feel safe with a guy, after what you have been through and are still experiencing through situations that trigger certain feelings of being trapped and unsafe etc. But while sleeping with another girl, you will form attachments, and if she finds a guy then where do you sleep?, you are back to square one where you have to overcome and challenge certain responses. It is not impossible to change, it is difficult, and made so much easier with people who understand your dilemma.

Hence the use of the term IMMINENT. Even the apostolic churches believed that Christ could come for His saints right then. And that corresponds to what the Lord had said. It will be sudden, unexpected, and swift, "for in such an hour as ye think not, the Son of Man cometh". It will be the Bridegroom coming for His Bride, not the Judge coming for His enemies. Following that there will be the Tribulation period, and then the Second Coming of Christ with His saints will be something that can be expected by the inhabitants of the earth. When Christ comes at that time "every eye shall see Him". Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and theyalso which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. (Rev 1:7) And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him. (Jude 14,15).

Thanks for the concern but, really, I don't see a thorough study of Scripture in anything you have posted either. Do you feel you are qualified to judge another's understanding of the Bible? Pretribbers realize that NO ONE really knows the timing of the Rapture and with that we know that we could be wrong. Nothing anyone says will change viewpoints on the matter. I would suggest that you need to read your Bible more and come to understand what is evident to others and the ability of others to come to their own conclusions. And that ISN'T a popular opinion.

HeartSearcher,I like your post. Blessings,7Dove77

2 Corinthians)-For no matter how many promises God has made,They are "YES" in Christ. And so through Him the "AMEN" is spoken by us to the Glory of God; Turtletwo,Blessings to you,With Gods Grace. 7Dove77

Luke 22:42 Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done. Luke 22:43 And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him. Luke 22:44 And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down to the ground. I don't know why else he would ask the Father to remove the cup from him unless he was afraid. It shows me that Christ experienced every emotion we have, and therefore qualified to understand what we go through for his name sake. I really don't want to get into an argument with you Algot, because i see you are quite good at debating and very right most of the time!

Short answer: NO.

Two different Gods? Two different Bibles? No, I assure you that I, and other PreTribbers worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and we read the one true Bible. It's kind of unfair to infer PreTribbers are worshipping another God. That's a terrible thing to say.

cool thank you , peace to you, also

NP It was me that misunderstood. Blessing Rusty

Shalom, again, Oakwood. Oh, and by the way, did you see this? This is a stereoscopic picture of the moon. Can you trust your eyes? Simply look "beyond" the picture as though you were looking across the room and line up the two middle images until you see three images and look carefully at the "middle" image. Now, regarding magnets: Haven't you ever done one simple experiment with magnets? All you have to do is get some metal filings and a piece of glass or plastic. Put the magnet under the glass with the glass held flat. Pour the metal filings on the top of the glass, and move the magnet around under the metal filings and see what they do. They follow what are called "magnetic lines of force." Magnetic lines of force do NOT follow a "straight line!" They follow CURVED lines outward from one pole (such as the North pole, N) to the other (such as the South pole, S). This is why so many bar magnets have the "S" and "N" symbols stamped on their ends. All magnets have both poles whether the magnet is a bar, a cube, a cylinder, a short cylinder (a disk), a U-shape, or a square U, a torus, or a spherical shape. They MUST have them both; they cannot exist without both poles. Indeed, the manetic N pole is the pole that points to the earth's north pole (which is how its north pole, N, was named)! The earth itself IS a huge sphere-shaped magnet! That is why there are TWO poles and why another magnet would be drawn to those poles. That's how a compass works! The needle of the compass IS a magnet and it follows the CURVED magnetic lines of force surrounding the earth! All science is not of the devil, y'know. Indeed, the devil is the copycat that steals God's natural laws and twists them for his own ends. There are many good, godly men and women who were and are scientists, giving God the glory for any inventions or innovations they have helped to discover. It would do you good to read about these men and women. Here's a starting point: 8 famous scientists who were Christians.

it was not intended at all to be a insult, at all , if you took it that way I will apologize, what I am really saying is that, if the watchman yells, wolf , to the people tending the sheep , and they say , we don't believe you , and go about there unbelief, then what good is that watchman, for he is there to do a job, and to inform, others as he is instructed to do , what I said, ,you can believe or deny it, but in all cases ? we tend to debate more about who is right and who is wrong, who is teaching the truth and who is misleading people, I will speak for my self I am passionate and loving to my fellow brothers and sisters, and we are not to take what we believe as lightly, remember the story of the Chinese, they did not warned them and they all were killed and perished, they were not ready to face what they did , for many and the leaders and the teachers, continued to say the things we hear all the time, ,its okay don't worry , its okay , no worries, we don't face no danger, God will rescue us, and its okay , ??? well if you want to believe, that what I have said, maybe in the future, ? I say it is here and ready to be placed in operation, it is another thing we can look forward too, so tell me this please, I am just asking? if some one says we are not going to end up in danger and we wont be killed, or harmed at all, have faith in God, ? and next thing you know, we are being taken, captive , and by force to meet our end by a system that they have that can do the job, to process , many and large numbers , would you think I am joking ? our Bibles tell us , if the ways of the devil and the world ran by the devil or the God of this world , and we need ,to open our eyes if we do not , then why are we even talking about God and the bible and the end times, if we are not wanting to face truth , and the last days, we have been warned of what is coming, and many continue to deny , it , so , that's all I was trying to say , thank you , and nothing here is personal , or made to insult or , to demean any one, , blessings and peace

yes it will take place, but to say it is a conspiracy ? huh.. well if you want to call it that, I think you have not kept up with , what is fact , and what is fiction, but lets stick to the bible , yes , and wish for the best, yes ,, lets do that, ,,lets, not think about it , lets think happy thoughts, right ?

well stated, I totally agree with that, I think it becomes, more of a democratic view, that takes the lead, over, most of the truth , most of the time, , that's why we have so much confusion, in our thinking and understanding, and many shot from the hip , with out ever opening the bible,

John says he saw the souls, and heard them cry out, and saw them given white robes. You say he didn't. Let's see, whom to believe...?

Esther: Thanks for your honest, sincere and well thought out posts. I found it pointless to try to carry on a legitimate discussion with her. Rather than simply quoting a statement made by me, she consistently chose to create labels and mischaracterizations of my position to shoot arrows at. In addition she kept trying to make the discussion personal about me rather than deal with the substance of my actual statements. I am normally more than willing to have an honest and civil discussion with people even if we disagree. However, if they consistently persist in Saul Alinsky types of tactics and constantly use ad hominem I find it too taxing to deal with. Thanks again Esther.

thank you for your passionate and honest, statement, it is taken for truth by me, on what you have said, and many are not willing to except this for they are comfortable, and so the religion they want ,is a social and peaceful gathering of nice people , and we know sooner or later we all have to see what is the COST,? to follow the real Jesus ?? in the bible ? and what its going to take, as far as what effects you and me , to survive in this world , blessings to you my sister, and continue, in the faith , I am thankful for brothers and sisters that are in tuned with the scriptures and are walking in the spirit , blessings to you and peace,

TurtleTwo, Im so blessed to see you posted here, Trust and believe,that God knows and understands what your going through. If your needing prayer,tell us,We are here to uplift each other,We may not fully understand your health issues,but ,we do care.. Many Blessings to you,With Gods Grace..7Dove77

Yes, we have a regular Politburo in this country and it wasn't built overnight. Politburo: the executive committee and chief policymaking body of a Communist Party. Basically, the Politburo would decide which candidates and laws the people could vote for in a communist country. It is a way to deceptively persecute the church because there is no other way to reasonably stop the church. The only thing you can do is try to find a way to govern them; thereby, finding a alternative way to dominate them. Soon, they will say we are unable to govern ourselves because of the joke our political system is in the way Britain told South Africa so they could continue to occupy their country . We will soon need "help." But, everything really centers on whether you are Christian or not no matter how diverse the media tries to portray it is by showing that Indians, or people without Christ, can have the same if not better morals and concern for the environment than Christians. That is what that ad is about. It has nothing to do with Indians and I am not saying that this promotes Indians in a negative light either. The Native Americans did not pay for this ad. The responsibility should rest there. But, the ad was an attack on the church and a way of promoting the ideal that Christ is not necessary. Total Antichrist propaganda...

I personally , would not think to use the tribulation period as the seven years, or of the abomination of desolation, for we cannot say it has not already been completed , we are awaiting a beast type system that is not hidden for we see it today ,with our own eyes, we are seeing it, and we are not believing it, we have conditioned our selves to believe it will not happen to us, and its always them over there, my God loves me, and he said He be there, and so no harm can come to me, this is the thinking of the Christians today , that have not heeded the word of God, and listen to His teachings, for by there lips they worship and through there false belief system . man made traditions and reasoning away the truth for a lie, and a pass to, get out of harms way , is not what the bible preaches, it is not ? at all but we hang on that? , and so we deceive our selves to believe , not us, but to them , and this is not the right thinking we should have , as a believer, for we are all one under one God , and not separate as we are told to do , by the non believing , for the world wants us to hold on to hate and anger, and to keep the boundries of race divided, never coming together , as one people , under the real God , in love for one another, and so , this is why we also need to stay away from thinking that we keep the lines drawn , and not love, ? many say I have been to hard on what to believe, and to have more love of God , and not so much the pain and persecution that can happen, for our God is love, ? Yes He is , a Loving God , and very compassionate, that left heaven ,and took on flesh to show that it was not what it was to be, But God saved us while we were yet sinners, and so while we were drowning in Sins, the life guard came, and pulled us all out as we believed in Him, and reached out our hands, to the savior, but not all believe in this savior and they talk about God, but its not the same God, of the bible, that died and rose again, its the one with out power, and the cross that means nothing, to us,? I believe in the cross, , jesus the son of God , and the Father God in heaven, that has told His children, I have over come the world , and you will have tribulation and pain and death until I come back, FACT !! and until I come back we must EDURE until the end of our time, holding on to what was told to us, by the one that is able to save, for what we are in the roaring oceans of life, and our savior is reaching out to hold on to us ,until the storm passes, we get caught up in the worlds interpretation of how the dominos fall, and yet, it is not made to be understood that way ? , for the wise are confronted by the simple ,and the meek and the humble, and until they see the love in the humble and the obedience, of the power of God in us, then there is only religion ?, for there is no faith were religion is,. for it is not a religion we believe,!! in us, is faith and belief of the heart mind and soul , and for these things, no one can have it, unless you forfeit it, to the God of this world, but you do that when you let Go ,of the saviors hand, and so let go and drown in the sea of the world , or hold on, until the storm passes, for it also shall pass, all things will pass, but we need to be willing to die for what we believe , and not fear, or even think twice about it, it is that love and belief , that we place our faith in, for as the enemy comes crashing down on us , we are singing hosanna , and praises to the glory of God, as a witness to others, to see the glory , and it is in us, that are filled with the spirit of God , words of encouragement in the storms, and roaring seas, we are not to be tossed about , but to be focused, and firm in Him...AMEN... blessings and peace to you , and always seek the face of God, He is our light and our path to life ....and the WAY is NARROW and HARD.

Are the other planets, stars, etc in our solar system and our sun and moon also flat. Does anything orbit? Are electrons that orbit the nucleus of the atom or the atoms themselves flat or are atoms a deception. Can telescopes be trusted for anything? If not, what texts and scientific instruments can we trust in. Can we really trust a compass? Is the earth completely stationary? How deep can we drill down into the earth before a hole is created that someone could fall through? Does anyone or anything live on the bottom of the flat earth?

Wouldn't this view make a flight from South America to Australia almost impossible, given planes can only hold so much fuel, passengers would surely know if they passed over ocean, or took a "short cut" by flying over the north pole, flight times reported of 12 to 13 hours would be impossible, every pilot flying international flights would have to understand this proposed flat earth?

Earth never had vapor like Venus. Earth had water vapor. How tall were you twenty billion years ago? <-- same sort of question

easy, east, west, north, south. How do you create anti-gravity for the satellites we have hovering over earth?

That is one of the strongest reasons of support for pre-trib catching up.... anything else mid or post we would know more the day and hour Last Daze is correct. In addition, this pre-trib claim that the Second Coming and the Rapture are two exclusive/different things is just one in a rather long list of pre-trib's non-biblical teachings. The Rapture takes place at the Second Coming, as the same passage from 2 Thes 2 makes clear: 2 Thes. 2:1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ AND our gathering together to Him... "Our" -- the Church's -- gathering to Jesus "in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air" = the Rapture at the Lord's Coming.

How funny. I remember a time in my marriage to the most wonderful man in shoe leather saying something to me that most women would have hit the ceiling over. I had put on a few pounds. I injured my back several years earlier. It was a severe injury. I was struggling with a lot of pain. My sweet Steve, just very gently suggested to me that maybe the pain was because I had gained a few pounds and if I lost it I might feel better. I agreed totally. I lost 30 pounds and felt like a new girl. He said it in love and out of concern for me. He was so proud of the way I looked. I guess it's all in how you say it. Steve loved me just as I was but didn't like to see me hurting. That is what I call genuine love. I sure do miss him. So ladies learn to thank God for your mate that God has given you, he is a gift from God.

William Dan 9:27 - he will confirm a covenant with many for ONE WEEK (see the word ONE, the final week of the 70 Weeks). In the middle of the Seven (One needs to have a Whole One Seven to have a midpoint) Matt 24:15 - So when you see standing in the holy place, the A/D spoken by the prophet Daniel, let the reader understand; then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. Let no one on the roof of his house go down to take anything out of the house. Let no one in the field go back to get his cloak. So if one looks closely, one who is (working) in the field not to go back to retrieve his cloak. This puts an axe into the 70 AD scenario, for all in and around Jerusalem who were under siege, they could not flee. This tells those to flee once they see the A/D set up or standing in the holy place, not before as in 70 AD. Titus did not get into the Temple until they broke the Jewish lines of defense, and then the temple was burning with gold dripping down, Titus's army had destroyed most of the Temple before Titus got there.. You are the one who is adding to Scripture. In Christ Montana Marv