Is the Falling Away a false teaching ?

[TheMatrixHasU71]

20 hours ago, eileenhat said:

I do not follow satan.

I follow God.

If you do not enjoy my messages, do not reply.

You do not follow God because you are spreading nothing but lies here. You need to repent or LEAVE

[TheMatrixHasU71]

13 hours ago, brakelite said:

1 Thess. 4:15  For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16  For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17  Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
The above passage refers to none other event than the second coming. Two distinct things occur at this time. One, Jesus calls forth the dead of all ages whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life and they en-masse rise from their graves in the first of two major resurrections pertaining to the last days. At the same time, they which are yet alive are changed, as we read in

1 Corinthians 15:52  In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed....

These two scriptures are describing the same event...the Lord returning to take His bride home. Any other rapture prior to this event is a misreading and misunderstanding of scripture.

1 Thess 4:17 is nothing but the Pre Trib Rapture.

Note that the scripture mentions being taken up to the Lord in the clouds, in the air. NOT Jerusalem when Jesus comes back down to earth, IN THE AIR. IN HEAVEN.

Remember please that this was written during a time when people had little concept of a heaven outside of this universe. Even the childish concept of heaven begin somewhere in the clouds is a remnant of the idea that people had in ancient times of heaven being somewhere above the clouds.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

7 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Have you ever considered the fact that He never said in this passage that He was taking us TO that place He's going to prepare for us? 

That's right.  He had a place in Nazareth.  A nice high rancher.

I go to prepare a place for you.  This is on the eve of His Crucifixion and subsequent Resurrection and then Ascension.
So far you have no evidence that Jesus put His carpenter skills to work in Israel...

[Last Daze]

23 minutes ago, Davida said:

 People don't have to intentionally follow Satan to be mislead by false spirits.   

Good point and relevant to these days.

[Steve_S]

3 hours ago, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

You do not follow God because you are spreading nothing but lies here. You need to repent or LEAVE

TheMatrixHasU71 was banned from this thread and will receive a warning point for the above post.

[Retrobyter]

5 hours ago, Ezra said:

Retro,

How can you say that when the words of Christ are as plain as can be?  Please note:

In my Father's house = Heaven

I go to prepare a place for you = Christ in Heaven at present

I will come again, and receive you unto myself = Rapture

that where I am, there ye may be also = taking us TO that place

Shalom, Ezra.

Really? The "Father's house" is NOT "Heaven!" That is a MAJOR, FALSE ASSUMPTION!!!

Sorry, but that is NOT true! Look at Revelation 21:1-3:

Revelation 21:1-3
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth (Greek : for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God (Greek: hee skeenee tou Theou) is with men, and he will dwell (Greek: skeenoosei met' autoon) with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
KJV

Now, compare this to Hebrews 11:

Hebrews 11:8-10
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with (Greek: en skeenais meta) Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
KJV

Like that of Avraham, the New Jerusalem will be a TENT! The TENT of God! A Bedouin tent like that of Avraham, the HOME of God! The New Jerusalem is the Father's House!

Based on this, Yeshua` the Messiah (Christ) went to the New Jerusalem, not some "Heaven!"

Finally, the phrase, "that where I am, there ye may be also," has NOTHING TO DO WITH "taking us TO that place!"

Yeshua`, receiving them to Himself, is not receiving them to Heaven! When He returns, He will BE HERE, NOT THERE!

[Retrobyter]

7 hours ago, Marcus O'Reillius said:

That's right.  He had a place in Nazareth.  A nice high rancher.

I go to prepare a place for you.  This is on the eve of His Crucifixion and subsequent Resurrection and then Ascension.
So far you have no evidence that Jesus put His carpenter skills to work in Israel...

Shalom, Marcus.

Let's take this slowly, shall we? I did NOT say that Yeshua` wasn't going somewhere, just that He was NOT going to "Heaven." However, He WAS going to the New Jerusalem ... under construction. Curiously, the descriptions that people have for "Heaven" are to be found in the description of the New Jerusalem in Revelation 21 and 22.

What I said was "Have you ever considered the fact that He never said in this passage that He was taking us TO that place He's going to prepare for us?" And, HE'S NOT!

Follow:

1. Yeshua` left this earth (Crucifixion, Resurrection, Ascension) Acts 1:9-11.
2. Yeshua` arrived in the New Jerusalem, the "Tent of God," His Father's House. John 14:1-3.
3. Yeshua` has been building "rooms/mansions" for us since then. John 14:2.
4. Yeshua` will return sometime in the future. John 14:3; Acts 1:11.
5. Yeshua` won't be taking us back to the New Jerusalem; rather, He will take us with Him to Israel so "that where He is, there we will be also."
6. We will be accompanying Yeshua` in His Rescue of the nation - HIS nation - HIS FAMILY - Israel.
7. His Kingdom during the Millennium will begin shortly (3.5 years) after His Return. 
8. As Yeshua` becomes "King of kings," or "World Emperor," we will rule and reign with Him as subordinate kings in His hierarchy. Rev. 20:1-6.
9. After the Millennium, the Rebellion of the Children of the Wicked One will occur. Rev. 20:7-9.
10. The rebellion will end with the Global Fire. Rev. 20:9; 2 Pet. 3:7-12.
11. After the Fire, the Great White Throne Judgment will be held. Rev. 20:10-15.
12. Following the GWTJ, the ground (the surface of the earth) and the sky will be re-formed. Rev. 21:1.
13. The New Jerusalem will then arrive and land upon the New Earth, and ... Rev. 21:2-3.
14. The Eternal State will be achieved. Rev. 21:4-5.

Out of time. I will give verses for the rest when I return.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

7 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

5. Yeshua` won't be taking us back to the New Jerusalem; rather, He will take us with Him to Israel so "that where He is, there we will be also."

No.  There is no Scripture which describes immortal, imperishable people residing in the land of Israel, which is apportioned to the twelve tribes in Ezekiel chapter 48.
Furthermore, we have no need for a ritualistic, periodical, system of animal sacrifice which is in Ezekiel and has yet to be fulfilled.

In all the Millennium passages in Isaiah, there is no mention of immortal, imperishable people living alongside people who are mortal and perishable.

Now an omission of a fact does not mean it is not, but you have no direct evidence for what you have concluded in your own mind.
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Where Jesus is going in John 14:1-3 is to Heaven - and not just the sky; but the abode of the Father.
That is where He is going to prepare a place for us.
Jesus is not saying He is going to Israel when He informs the Disciples of His soon-to-be departure from them.
He is giving them a future promise, for which Christians all over still hope.
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We will rule on the earth, and in the final portion of this old earth's time, after Satan is loosed from his prison (the abyss?) and incites the whole world (who once lived in peace under Christ's iron rod rule administered by us) ~ they come upon God's "camp" at Jerusalem.

Rev 20:9 And they came up on the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, and fire came down from heaven and devoured them.

NOTICE: we are not apportioned any land in Revelation, but are relegated to the "beloved" city, and our "camp."

parembole, as used in the Bible means: 1.an encampment.  This refers to a camp of Israel in the desert.  It is also used for the city of Jerusalem, inasmuch as that was to the Israelites what formerly the encampment had been in the desert.  It can also be used for the sacred congregation or assembly of Israel, as it had been gathered formerly in camps in the wilderness.  Alternate definitions which are not pertinent: It is also used for the Roman barracks in Jerusalem (Antonia) and the second definition 2: an army in a line of battle.

Now, one: WHEN the land of Israel is divided, a special portion, "a holy portion", "an allotment to the Lord" will be made - Ezekiel 45:1
Two: Eze 45:4 It shall be the holy portion of the land; it shall be for the priests, the ministers of the sanctuary, who come near to minister to the Lord, and it shall be a place for their houses and a holy place for the sanctuary.

Thus, we can find where we have a temporary abode in Jerusalem, a camp.
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As to heaven, which you have gone on and on at great length (and as to your long posts: literally nobody reads them) - words can have more than one meaning:

Heaven is a place too; not just the sky.

heaven: The place where God most fully makes known his presence to bless. It is in heaven where God most fully reveals his glory, and where angels, other heavenly creatures, and redeemed saints all worship him. (57 A.1) ~ (from Systematic Theology, Copyright © 1994 by Wayne Grudem. All rights reserved.)

Heaven is our true home, where our citizenship resides, and where our inheritance and treasures are.  (From the Epistles of Paul and Peter).
Heaven is where we will be arrayed before the Throne with palm branches in Rev 7:9-17.
 

[Marcus O'Reillius]

8 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

6. We will be accompanying Yeshua` in His Rescue of the nation - HIS nation - HIS FAMILY - Israel.

The 144,000 never leaven Jesus' side.  Rev 14:4.

Now ask yourself, would you take your bride to war for her honeymoon?
Ask yourself again: Does the LORD need billions of people to trample out His Wrath against hundreds of millions?

Jesus said the gathered wheat would be taken to the barn of Heaven, while the collected tares would be burned in the field of this world. (Mt 13)
We see that with the Great Multitude before the Father - in Heaven - before the first blood and fire Trumpet of the desolations He has decreed goes forth (Rev 7, 8)

The LORD does have an army with Him in Joel 2.
They are special, and I put it to you, that they are the sealed Firstfruits of the Harvest: the 144,000.

[Marcus O'Reillius]

8 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

7. His Kingdom during the Millennium will begin shortly (3.5 years) after His Return. 

This statement of yours is wholly a product of your eschatology.
It is not factually stated anywhere in Scripture.