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Question for christians

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26 replies to this topic

#1
nickname

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Since the christians had a chance to ask atheists questions, it seemed fair to have a topic where atheists could ask christians questions. The purpose of this isn't to debate, nor argue, nor to 'prove' nor 'disprove' anything, but rather to understand different perspectives, and allow members from both sides of the spectrum, as well as those currently inbetween/indecsive, to explain why they believe, and think, as they do. I will understand if a moderator shuts this down, should it become too 'chaotic' and veers from the original intent, or if they don't see it as a viable topic, or if there was already a topic for this purpose that has already been discontinued/atrophied.

#2
Jayyycuuup

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Heya Nick :)

Could you by chance start this off by what you believe?

#3
nickname

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The term "agnostic" seems most appropriate, as I have no claim to the existence, or non-existence of God, only that I personaly have never discoverd any supporting evidence for him. However, as the topic is about questions directed to christians, stating my position isn't congruent to this particular discussion.

#4
franciskelsey

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Hi Nick. Actually this could be an interesting topic.

Welcome to worthy, though it appears you been here a little while now.

First, let me ask you. Is there a reason you do not believe in God?

Have you ever tried calling out to God and asking Him to reveal Himself to you?

Have you ever considered creation and the complexity of it all, including us?

I believe based in what I see is facts that are all around us. I believe because He called me, revealed Himself to me, and He lives inside of me. I believe because He has changed my heart to having nothing to live for to a purpose for my being. A heart of stone to a heart of bread. I believe because He answers prayers. I believe He will answer your prayers too if you seek Him out. He has made so we can fellowship with Him.

Have you ever considered the start of all things? The life of all things? The beginnings of evil and love?

What would you do if it was proven there was a God? Would you confess your sins, if you believe you have any, and worship Him? Do you have any reason not to believe?

Yes, I do like asking questions. :)

#5
Tinky

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What is your first question, Nick?

#6
FresnoJoe

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.... to explain why they believe, and think, as they do.....


The Agnostic, The Atheist, The Pagan
The Many, The Proud, The Damned

And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

I receive not honour from men. But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. John 5:37-42

And The Believers
Lovers Of Truth

Neither have I gone back from the commandment of his lips; I have esteemed the words of his mouth more than my necessary food. Job 23:12

~

So Beloved

O taste and see that the LORD is good: blessed is the man that trusteth in him. Psalms 34:8

What Will You Eat?

Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and thy word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart: for I am called by thy name, O LORD God of hosts. Jeremiah 15:16

~

Believe

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

And Be Blessed

Love, Joe

#7
thomas t

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The Agnostic, The Atheist, The Pagan
The Many, The Proud, The Damned
[... my snip]

And The Believers
Lovers Of Truth
[...]

Dear Joe,
are you really sure about that? I mean the Bible says that demons are belivers, too?
I also suppose that if someone is raised in a strongly religious surrounding he will believe, by default.
I wish you a very nice day
Thomas

#8
FresnoJoe

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Dear Joe,
are you really sure about that? I mean the Bible says that demons are believers, too?
I also suppose that if someone is raised in a strongly religious surrounding he will believe, by default.
I wish you a very nice day
Thomas


Thank You Dear Tom

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

~

Demons Have No Love Of Jesus

And when he was come out of the ship, immediately there met him out of the tombs a man with an unclean spirit,
Because that he had been often bound with fetters and chains, and the chains had been plucked asunder by him, and the fetters broken in pieces: neither could any man tame him.
And always, night and day, he was in the mountains, and in the tombs, crying, and cutting himself with stones.
But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him,
And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.

For he said unto him, Come out of the man, thou unclean spirit. Mark 5:2-8

The Agnostic, The Atheist, The Pagan Have No Fear Of Jesus

The transgression of the wicked saith within my heart, that there is no fear of God before his eyes. Psalms 36:1

But The Believer Worships Jesus From Bended Knees Of Adoration

As the hart panteth after the water brooks, so panteth my soul after thee, O God. Psalms 42:1

What Do You Think? :)

#9
nickname

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What is your first question, Nick?


My first question would be, if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?

#10
nickname

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I will try to answer your questions earnestly franciskelsey, although most of these I haven't often thought about

First, let me ask you. Is there a reason you do not believe in God?


I have not personaly discovered any supporting evidence for God yet.

Have you ever tried calling out to God and asking Him to reveal Himself to you?


It seems logical that if God desired to do anything, he would not require my permisson, and should he want to reveal himself, will do so with, or without my input.

Have you ever considered creation and the complexity of it all, including us?


Although I had once considered it, presently I'm not that concerned with the origin or purpose of the universe, but more so with the current nature and sociological/technological direction of humanity.

Have you ever considered the start of all things? The life of all things? The beginnings of evil and love?


I had briefly considered the start and life of all things, but decided that neither was that important to me. From what I've observed, evil and love are innate, biological functions.

What would you do if it was proven there was a God? Would you confess your sins, if you believe you have any, and worship Him? Do you have any reason not to believe?


If it were proven there was a God, I would continue to live my life as I do now, although I would apologize for any sins I hadn't been aware of, and avoid comitting further transgressions. If worship is the same as respect, then yes, I would worship him. I don't maintain beliefs, but attempt to attain knowledge based on substantial evidence and accurate information.

#11
franciskelsey

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First of all, Nick, thank you much for responding -- to everything :) Secondly, you can just call me Frank. For that matter, you can call me whatever you want. I have probably been called worse. :) Once again, it's awesome to have you here. That being said, ::


What would you do if it was proven there was a God? Would you confess your sins, if you believe you have any, and worship Him? Do you have any reason not to believe?

If it were proven there was a God, I would continue to live my life as I do now, although I would apologize for any sins I hadn't been aware of, and avoid comitting further transgressions. If worship is the same as respect, then yes, I would worship him. I don't maintain beliefs, but attempt to attain knowledge based on substantial evidence and accurate information.



First, this blesses my Spirit. This means you are seeking answers and seeking the truth. This means hope can be right around the corner. :)

Have you ever considered creation and the complexity of it all, including us?

Although I had once considered it, presently I'm not that concerned with the origin or purpose of the universe, but more so with the current nature and sociological/technological direction of humanity.

Quote

Have you ever considered the start of all things? The life of all things? The beginnings of evil and love?

I had briefly considered the start and life of all things, but decided that neither was that important to me. From what I've observed, evil and love are innate, biological functions.


Maybe, my friend, you can expound on this deeper. Maybe we can start with detail where ever you choose. Perhaps I will go with your first question.

Have you ever tried calling out to God and asking Him to reveal Himself to you?


It seems logical that if God desired to do anything, he would not require my permisson, and should he want to reveal himself, will do so with, or without my input.


You are right. He needs no one's permission for anything. Nether does a father relating to the son. However, if the father loves his son, (1) would he not want his son to love him back (2) would he assert his authority just because he can (3) would he keep himself hidden if his son seeked him out?

Perhaps, just perhaps, He is in the process of revealing Himself to you now. Perhaps, just perhaps, if there were such thing as chance, secretly, without us being aware, God has led you here for a reason.

First, let me ask you. Is there a reason you do not believe in God?

I have not personaly discovered any supporting evidence for God yet.


We will work on that together my new friend.

What is your first question, Nick?

My first question would be, if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?


I believe, perhaps, there is a misunderstanding here. Even from the beginning, Adam and Eve had free will. However, they also had consequences based on their decisions. Thus death came to the entire earth, just as God had warned. The Israelite people made a contract with God. They made this choice based on God saving their hides. However, they did not have to honor their contract. If however, they did not, justice was not far behind. As a Christian, we are called to carry our cross daily, and follow Christ, and to be like Himself. When we surrendered our self to Him and made Him king in our lives, we have obligations to teach right from wrong and life from death.

You seem to be understanding the way of God in free choice is a way of no consequences. We both know every decision has results, and sometimes bad and good. Free will is the choice of life and death. Heaven or hell. As Christians, we would like to see things as God would like to see things. No killings of babies, no murder period, families of Tammy and Joe instead of Jerry and Jerry. Dedicated mothers and fathers who raise their children to learn responsibility and work, as to the knowledge of how to make a living and provide for the family. You see, as Christians, we want to see good results from good labor, and not the bad results from bad choices. Christians do not aim, like some, to ensure every one is a Christian or we chop off your head. No, there is no love their, or free will. No freedom at all.

When this country was first founded, we had the right when the constitution was signed, to keep the state out of the church, and not today where the church has to stay out of the state, thus why congress use to pray and public schools use to learn scripture. Freedom of religion was not meant to be freedom to do acts against our nation of hatred and call it religion, but that we all could worship the one true God in our own ways.

I hope you half way see where I am going.

Do you give your child freedom? Do you have limits on his freedom and punishments for going beyond those limits? If so, why? Perhaps, because you love him, and you want him to be safe and grow to respect others and be helpful or a blessing to others as he grows. Would I be right?

It has been a blessing talking with you. I look forward to future discussion. God bless

#12
chloe_fantastic

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What is your first question, Nick?


My first question would be, if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?


Because I believe a responsible citizen would desire that justice be done in their land. Now the tension comes in when we all have different ideas as to what justice looks like, as you can plainly see over in the Capital Punishment thread.

#13
MorningGlory

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What is your first question, Nick?


My first question would be, if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?


There is NO law requiring you to believe any religious doctrine....assuming you're American, Canadian, British or Australian, of course. Don't know about other countries.

#14
nebula

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My first question would be, if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?


Hello Nick,

If you will notice, the government God established in the Torah is full of "making governemental law out of beliefs and practices." So, you would have to either argue that the concept of freewill is incorrect, or you would have to re-evaluate the premise of your argument. That is, if "God's policy is freewill," why would He create governmental laws that regulate beliefs and behavior?

Now what does "freewill" mean? Does it mean there are no rights and no wrongs, that behavior should not be regulated, that nothing is punished?

But let's go further - what are "hate laws" but the regulation of beliefs and practices? (Why should a crime with a "hate" motive be punished more severely than the same crime with a different motive?)

Likewise, what do you make of laws, regulations, and taxes that punish greed?

#15
Guest_ninhao_*

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My first question would be, if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?


Hello Nickname,

The instruction from Jesus is for His followers to "let your light shine before all men". This can apply to the actions, words etc of the follower. I'm not sure if this can be used as reason why Christians attempt to influence law making.

I am answering with these subjects in mind ( abortion, marriage, freedom of religion ).

The most logical reason, to me, is that Christians are philanthropists who want the best for all people. Of course there are also non Christian philanthropists who may have other ideals. Christians are also lovers of God and this is how we hopefully know what is best for all people. I have heard Christians use the reasoning that evil flourishes when good men do nothing ( E.Burke ).

The reasoning that we are attempting to skirt God's free will edict by doing this is interesting. I don't think a Christian petitioning the government to change laws is doing this. Christians don't want the government to institute Christianity as law.

#16
nickname

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Thank you everyone who replied to my question. I don't have any followup questions at the moment.

#17
FresnoJoe

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What would a wise person want?

Does a man locked in chains, inside a prison want others to just tell him about the joy outside the prison. Does that man want to hear how we can drive where we want, and eat what we want? Go to the store when we want?

Or

Would that man in prison rather hear about how we that are free, are going to get him out of prison, that he may be free?

What does a wise man pick?

I am not sure who is the person in prison and locked in chain your analogy refers to. The believer or the unbeliever? LOL, .. , kidding.

However, your analogy fails because I know virtually no atheist who considers herself in a sort of intellectual or spiritual prison, whatever that means. I wonder where you got this idea from. Of course, I might be wrong, but I fail to see the wisdom of asking freedom from a non existing prison.


Beloved, If You Ever Get The Gift Of Sight Again

But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2 Corinthians 4:3-4

You Will Find You Are Trapped In The Tanglefoot Of Sin

Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. John 8:34

And You Will Know Whom To Call

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed. John 8:36

Until Then Enjoy

And he spake a parable unto them, saying, The ground of a certain rich man brought forth plentifully:
And he thought within himself, saying, What shall I do, because I have no room where to bestow my fruits?
And he said, This will I do: I will pull down my barns, and build greater; and there will I bestow all my fruits and my goods.
And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry.
But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?
So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.
Luke 12:16-21

For Without Jesus, You Know It Does Not Get Any Better Than This

Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
Ecclesiastes 12:13-14

~

Believe

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

And Be Blessed Beloved

Love, Joe

#18
Willamina

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Many of the first settlers of this land came here seaking religious freedom, so several of the first colonies were theocracies. The first
text books were the Bible. Our founding fathers were nearly all Christians and some were even pastors. In fact, it was a group of
pastors that promoted our seaking independance from England. We granted religious tolarance to Jews in some states. But the bill of rights gave us freedom from any denomination being the state religion. We did not want to be like Europe. I have a book of speaches
the presidents of our country up to 1859 when the book was published. They were intensly Christian in nature, even proclaiming
that unless our populus is godly, our government will fail. It was an accurate prophecy.
Christianity was built into our schools and into our government. The universities today have perverted history. Those early leaders are proclaimed to be agnostic by modern scholars and it is utter nonsense.
So it is not so much that we are trying to impose our beliefs through law. The laws have been there since our nation was settled. But Christians are loosing their freedom of worship and the freedom of speach or to publicly celebrate Christian holidays. The Bill of rights
guarenteed us these rights but they are being twisted by the surpreme court to mean the opposit.The media has made us the bad guys.
And this perversion of truth is now taught in universities.
It is now OK to teach other religions in our public schools but not even Thankgiving can be mentioned in government sponsered school
programs.
Secular values and beliefs are now imposed on Christians. And most of us are stinkin mad about.
People do not become Christians by osmosis. But at least they had more respect for Christianity when it was taught and practiced in
schools. Still it is each kid's choice whether to be come a believer or not.
Chri

#19
OneLight

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Since the christians had a chance to ask atheists questions, it seemed fair to have a topic where atheists could ask christians questions. The purpose of this isn't to debate, nor argue, nor to 'prove' nor 'disprove' anything, but rather to understand different perspectives, and allow members from both sides of the spectrum, as well as those currently inbetween/indecsive, to explain why they believe, and think, as they do. I will understand if a moderator shuts this down, should it become too 'chaotic' and veers from the original intent, or if they don't see it as a viable topic, or if there was already a topic for this purpose that has already been discontinued/atrophied.

The purpose of this Outer Court is as follows from the ToS:

The outer Court is an area where we allow anyone who wishes to learn more about our belief to ask questions and learn.


Your asking questions is why this forum is here. Christians are instructed in 1 Peter 3:15 "But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts, and always be ready to give a defense to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear;"

Your Question:

  • if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?
The laws have nothing to do with our Christian walk. Yet, as everyone has the ability to voice an opinion, so do Christians. It is called Democracy. Just as Atheist have the right to speak against religious beliefs, those who hold them have the right to speak for them, each trying to have their ideas put forward. This idea, by no means, takes away from anyone choices. They choose as they will. THis also could be asked of those who like to go faster than the speed limit. Why force anyone to do anything they don't want? Unless you enjoy anarchy, laws need to be in place.

#20
Fez

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Nickname

Your Question:

  • if God's policy is freewill (allowing individuals to choose their own path, in spite of the circumstances), why would Christians attempt to circumvent that policy, by having their beliefs and practices instituted as government law?


It's not God's "policy", He does not have "policy" He has His Will.

And as His will is to give us all freewill, His Desire, grounded solely on Love for you, is that you come to know Him as your Lord and Savior.

But He is not going to force you, the choice is yours. You are more free under God than you will ever be under any man made policy and resultant law.




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