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Did Jesus pay for ALL sin (past, present, and future sin)?

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#321
firestormx

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Forgiveness of sins was still part of Christ's mission and ministry. And that goes back to the OP, which ask "Christ paid for all our sins - past, present, and future. I disagree with the OP. I believe that Christ forgave our past sins, and the present sins that we confessed to. But there is nothing in scripture saying that our future sins are ALREADY forgiven..


To say they are paid for is different from saying they are all forgiven. All sin was paid for by his death on the cross, but forgiveness comes only once we confess our sins with our mouth and believe in our heart. Then his sacrifice is attruibuted to us. It's like your holding the winning lottery ticket, but If you die without claiming the prize, then you forfiet the prize. Christ has already paid the price for all sin. Jesus doesn't have to pay the price for our sin again. He did it once and is now sit down at the right hand of the Father until his enemies be made his footstool. The responsibility to accept him and his sacrifice is now ours. Christ paying for all our sins past presant and future, is not the same thing as saying all sin for every person is forgiven past presant and future. If that was the case, then every person who ever lived would go to heaven.

Firestormx
Joseph

#322
Psalm25

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Just to add my 2 cents it is hard to answer this question without getting into stuff like once saved always saved, but to answer simply salvation does not come from works alone. When we are saved we want to turn from sin. We will never be sin free while we are here in the flesh, Jesus was the only man and ever will be the only man to walk sin free. But there is a big difference between sinning but trying to stop and resenting that sin, not wanting to sin.. then there is sinning freely without concern or wanting to stop but simply enjoying it and because Jesus covered us and we are good to go so to speak.

It is almost like a child who wants to please his/her parents. Everything the child does he/she does to make the parents proud and happy because the parents mean teh world to the child. The child depends on the parents for everything and loves the parents like no one else. Now kids are kids, and children can't help but to mess up at times. But they mess up because they are kids, they do not do it to hurt their parents on purpose and they feel terrible when they do mess up. When a little child does something that makes the parents upset the child was not thinking at the time "I will do this because I know my parents will forgive me so I will take full advantage of that and do whatever I want" The child was likely taken by a moment of temptation to get into the cookie jar so to speak. I know my little boy loves me and his mom more than words can describe, he always wants to be with us and always wants our attention. I have never seen him want to be by himself, he wants to be right there between us from the time he wakes up until the time he goes to bed. When my wife cleans he wants to help clean. When I tinker at fixing something he wants to tinker too. Whatever we do he wants to do too. I think of a relationship with Jesus like that, there is no time we should say "ok Jesus, I need some time alone to do a few things your not going to enjoy" but rather we want to be with him, we feel a need to be with him always, and we are always trying to please him. But in the moment that we slip because of our sinful ways as humans and put our hand in the cookie jar we feel terrible about it.

I also believe a Christian never stops growing, there is never a point in this life when a Christian says I've reached the peak of my walk with Christ and I am now sin free. I will stop myself here before I get into free will and once saved always saved subjects.

Edited by Psalm25, 28 February 2013 - 07:50 AM.


#323
OneLight

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There are many things not recorded in the Holy Bible. We know, for example, that after He ascended into Heaven, Christ raised the dead through the Apostle Peter in Acts 9:40, but there was no record of Christ giving that authority to Peter or any of the Apostles to do miracles. After His resurrection, Christ told His Apostles to baptize all nations, preach the Gospel to all nations, and to forgive sins or retain sins. There was no mention of any authority to perform miracles such as raising the dead given. John explains the reason for the absent in scripture best:

John 20:25 There are also many other things that Jesus did, but if these were to be described individually, I do not think the whole world would contain the books that would be written.


We do read of when Jesus spoke in Acts 1:4-8

And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Therefore, when they had come together, they asked Him, saying, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” And He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has put in His own authority. But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.

Through the power brought by the Holy Spirit does one accomplish such works, as you say.

#324
firestormx

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Forgiveness of sins was still part of Christ's mission and ministry. And that goes back to the OP, which ask "Christ paid for all our sins - past, present, and future. I disagree with the OP. I believe that Christ forgave our past sins, and the present sins that we confessed to. But there is nothing in scripture saying that our future sins are ALREADY forgiven..


To say they are paid for is different from saying they are all forgiven. All sin was paid for by his death on the cross, but forgiveness comes only once we confess our sins with our mouth and believe in our heart. Then his sacrifice is attruibuted to us. It's like your holding the winning lottery ticket, but If you die without claiming the prize, then you forfiet the prize. Christ has already paid the price for all sin. Jesus doesn't have to pay the price for our sin again. He did it once and is now sit down at the right hand of the Father until his enemies be made his footstool. The responsibility to accept him and his sacrifice is now ours. Christ paying for all our sins past presant and future, is not the same thing as saying all sin for every person is forgiven past presant and future. If that was the case, then every person who ever lived would go to heaven.

Firestormx
Joseph



Hello Brother Joseph,

The Bible says that He paid for past sins.

Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Paying for our sins means to forgive our sins. That was what His sacrifice on the cross was about because He was the Lamb of God who took away sins. Christ did His part in taking away our sins. Now, we need to do our part in making sure that we confess and repent from our sins. As the Apostle Peter said AFTER Pentecost when the crowd asked what they should do.......Repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." The Apostle Peter never said to do nothing because all sins were paid for.


If all sin is forgiven, then everyone goes to heaven.

#325
GoldenEagle

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Forgiveness of sins was still part of Christ's mission and ministry. And that goes back to the OP, which ask "Christ paid for all our sins - past, present, and future. I disagree with the OP. I believe that Christ forgave our past sins, and the present sins that we confessed to. But there is nothing in scripture saying that our future sins are ALREADY forgiven..


To say they are paid for is different from saying they are all forgiven. All sin was paid for by his death on the cross, but forgiveness comes only once we confess our sins with our mouth and believe in our heart. Then his sacrifice is attruibuted to us. It's like your holding the winning lottery ticket, but If you die without claiming the prize, then you forfiet the prize. Christ has already paid the price for all sin. Jesus doesn't have to pay the price for our sin again. He did it once and is now sit down at the right hand of the Father until his enemies be made his footstool. The responsibility to accept him and his sacrifice is now ours. Christ paying for all our sins past presant and future, is not the same thing as saying all sin for every person is forgiven past presant and future. If that was the case, then every person who ever lived would go to heaven.

Firestormx
Joseph



Hello Brother Joseph,

The Bible says that He paid for past sins.

Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Paying for our sins means to forgive our sins. That was what His sacrifice on the cross was about because He was the Lamb of God who took away sins. Christ did His part in taking away our sins. Now, we need to do our part in making sure that we confess and repent from our sins. As the Apostle Peter said AFTER Pentecost when the crowd asked what they should do.......Repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." The Apostle Peter never said to do nothing because all sins were paid for.


If all sin is forgiven, then everyone goes to heaven.


I agree, which is why I don't think all present and future sins were paid for.


All sin is atoned for at the Cross through Jesus Christ. (One time payment or sacrifice)

All sin is forgiven when there is repentence except for rejecting God's Holy Spirit in denying Jesus Christ. (In time whenever the request is made)

When people ask God to forgive their sins He does so because of the Holy Spirit living in them if they are Christ-followers. (In time whenever the request is made)


#326
firestormx

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If all sin is forgiven, then everyone goes to heaven.

I agree, which is why I don't think all present and future sins were paid for.


The bible dosen't teach that everyone goes to heaven, I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on this.

#327
Guest_ninhao_*

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Father, Son, and Holy Spirit has always been one and never separate. Distinct but definitely not separate. In the same way, Husbands and wives are distinct from each other in that the husband is the head of the house and the wife is not, but they are one. The Bible never says that the husband and wife is separate, but there is a distinction. A distinction is not a separation. I hope that helps in explaining it more.


Ok. Father Son and Holy spirit are all God yes. The comparison to husband and wife is still a little sketchy though. A husband and wife perform different and independent things while being in unison. They are in eachothers presence in essence but not always physically.

I suppose I get you, but I still can't apply that the Father died on the cross this seems specifically related to Jesus. This doesn't line up with what actually happened nor with any analogies I can find in the bible. For instance Abraham offering Isaac on the alter, but God instead providing the sacrifice etc.

We can say God the Son died, but we can't say the Father or the Holy Spirit died. If we die that doesn't mean the Holy Spirit , Jesus , or even the Father in us dies.

#328
Guest_ninhao_*

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However, the bond between Father, Son, and Holy Spirit can never be broken because there is no death for them. So, I think the word "separate" would be the wrong word to use.


Ok Selene I can live with that :) Would "different" be a more acceptable word?

I have heard a saying before " exactly the same but different" :D

#329
FresnoJoe

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Father, Son, and Holy Spirit has always been one and never separate. Distinct but definitely not separate. In the same way, Husbands and wives are distinct from each other in that the husband is the head of the house and the wife is not, but they are one. The Bible never says that the husband and wife is separate, but there is a distinction. A distinction is not a separation. I hope that helps in explaining it more....


Ok. Father Son and Holy spirit are all God yes. The comparison to husband and wife is still a little sketchy though. A husband and wife perform different and independent things while being in unison. They are in each other's presence in essence but not always physically.

I suppose I get you, but I still can't apply that the Father died on the cross this seems specifically related to Jesus. This doesn't line up with what actually happened nor with any analogies I can find in the bible. For instance Abraham offering Isaac on the alter, but God instead providing the sacrifice etc....

We can say God the Son died, but we can't say the Father or the Holy Spirit died. If we die that doesn't mean the Holy Spirit , Jesus , or even the Father in us dies....


.... the bond between Father, Son, and Holy Spirit can never be broken because there is no death for them. So, I think the word "separate" would be the wrong word to use....


Totally Synced

And when the living creatures went, the wheels went by them: and when the living creatures were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up. Whithersoever the spirit was to go, they went, thither was their spirit to go; and the wheels were lifted up over against them: for the spirit of the living creature was in the wheels. When those went, these went; and when those stood, these stood; and when those were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up over against them: for the spirit of the living creature was in the wheels. Ezekiel 1:19-21

See

That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me. John 17:21-23

#330
OneLight

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There are many things not recorded in the Holy Bible. We know, for example, that after He ascended into Heaven, Christ raised the dead through the Apostle Peter in Acts 9:40, but there was no record of Christ giving that authority to Peter or any of the Apostles to do miracles. After His resurrection, Christ told His Apostles to baptize all nations, preach the Gospel to all nations, and to forgive sins or retain sins. There was no mention of any authority to perform miracles such as raising the dead given. John explains the reason for the absent in scripture best:

John 20:25 There are also many other things that Jesus did, but if these were to be described individually, I do not think the whole world would contain the books that would be written.


We do read of when Jesus spoke in Acts 1:4-8

And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Therefore, when they had come together, they asked Him, saying, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” And He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has put in His own authority. But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.

Through the power brought by the Holy Spirit does one accomplish such works, as you say.


And when they did receive the Holy Spirit, the power they received was the "speaking of tongues." No mention of performing miracles such as raising the dead.

That is an assumption because speaking in tongues is what He had them do as a witness to others that the Holy Spirit has come upon them. Consider it in introduction to His arrival, is you wish, but tongues was not all they received. Speaking in tongues is, in fact, a miracle in itself, do you agree?

#331
GoldenEagle

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