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What are your thoughts on baptism and what are the verses that support

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#1
gigman7

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Looking for some point of views and the verses to support them.


#2
other one

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Acts 2:36-41

36 "Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christ —  this Jesus whom you crucified."

37 Now when they heard this, they were pierced to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Brethren, what shall we do?" 38 And Peter said to them, "Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 "For the promise is for you and your children, and for all who are far off, as many as the Lord our God shall call to Himself." 40 And with many other words he solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them, saying, "Be saved from this perverse generation!" 41 So then, those who had received his word were baptized ; and there were added that day about three thousand souls.
NASB

 

I do believe that Jesus put Peter up to saying that......     and since Jesus is my Lord, I have no choice but to do his will.

 

You can make all kinds of doctrine issues and what happens before during or after, but the face fact is you should be baptized because Jesus told you to.



#3
Wildstar

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There are some groups of people who believe in Jesus in some way that say that you NEED to be water baptized and that it is a requirement.  They may say that unless you're water baptized that you won't go to heaven.  Or they may shake your conscience into thinking that unless you are water baptized you can't be saved.  This is not true.

 

Faith is what saves you.  Take an example from Galatians 3 where they were being told that in order to become people of God they had to be circumcised.  Paul warned them to turn back or their faiths may have been in vain!  They were in danger for believing you could be save in another way other than the way Jesus told them!

 

Let's read Acts 10:43-48

All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.”
While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles.  For they heard them speaking in tongues and praising God.
Then Peter said,  “Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water. They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.”  So he ordered that they be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked Peter to stay with them for a few days.
 
In the above passage it clearly states "all those who believe in Jesus receive the remission of sins through Jesus name."  Peter was still speaking.  They believed in their hearts.  Suddenly the Holy Spirit came onto everyone who heard the message as they believed in their hearts.  Peter then said "Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water.  They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have."  Peter was with jewish believers who thought that gentiles shouldn't be water baptized and were denying them.  In this instance those gentiles believed in God with their hearts and were accepted by God.  There is no difference in the Spirit they received that the gentiles received.
 
What does having the holy spirit mean?  Read Ephesians 1:13-14
And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,  who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.
 
Again it states that when you believe in Christ you will be marked with a seal.  The seal is the Holy spirit.  Its a guarantee that as long as you have the seal you will get the inheritance until the day Jesus comes back.
 
You may be confused because verses like Acts 2:36-41 state that you should be water baptized.  OF COURSE YOU SHOULD BE!  But it's a false belief that this baptism saves you.  You get water baptized because you repent and believe in Jesus in the first place.
 
There are other verses like John 3:5 that state "Unless you are born of water and the Spirit you cannot enter the kingdom of God"  But this was referring to the ministries of John and Christ.  Acts 1:5 For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.  It was telling you to believe in both the ministry of John and Christ.  Johns parents were both descendants of Aaron legally making him a high priest.  In the time of Jesus there were two high priests, one was a deputy.  And John the one to make the path of the Lord straight by his baptism.  Even Jesus attested about John saying John was the greatest man to be born from women and that all generations will sing praises about him.
 
Anywho food for thought.


#4
FresnoJoe

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What are your thoughts on baptism and what are the verses that support

 

:thumbsup:

 

I

 

Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 1 Corinthians 2:13

 

Think

 

It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. John 6:63

 

Baptism

 

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. 1 Peter 1:23

 

Is Dyn-O-Mite !~!

 

I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: Matthew 3:11



#5
RigMedic

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Baptism is an outward expression of an inward faith. It is something a christian should do in obedience to Christ. I think if someone is a true born again Bible believing Christian they will desire to be baptized. I do not believe that baptism is necessary for salvation because that would take away from the cross.

Ephesians 2:8-9 NKJV

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.

I would just like to add one last thing. If water baptism was a necessity for salvation, that is, it was required to be saved, then Jesus would have been made a liar when he told the thief on the cross next to him that he would be in heaven. Am I missing the mark on this?

#6
Reformed Baptist

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You do not need to be baptised to be saved - the dying thief is ample testimony to that! However, if one is saved and one has the opportunity to be baptised it is unthinkable that such a person would refuse. Clearly Jesus Christ commands baptism, and clearly he also says,  John 14:15 "If you love Me, keep My commandments." to profess conversion but to refuse baptism is to say to Jesus, "I don't really love you enough to do the things that I know will please you!"



#7
RigMedic

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You do not need to be baptised to be saved - the dying thief is ample testimony to that! However, if one is saved and one has the opportunity to be baptised it is unthinkable that such a person would refuse. Clearly Jesus Christ commands baptism, and clearly he also says, John 14:15 "If you love Me, keep My commandments." to profess conversion but to refuse baptism is to say to Jesus, "I don't really love you enough to do the things that I know will please you!"


Agreed

Edited by RigMedic, 24 July 2014 - 12:43 PM.


#8
Willa

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Requirements for becoming a Christian are to choose to turn away from our sinful lives and to look to Jesus' death on the cross as granting us forgiveness.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said to them, "Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the Name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

The results of this vary as the Holy Spirit puts things on our hearts to do. He first led me to confess to my friends that I had asked God to forgive me, and then to read the Bible. But baptism helps people to realized that their old life is dead and buried, and they have been cleansed and raised to a new life in Christ.

Romans 6:3-4 Or do you not know, that as many of you who were baptized in to the Lord Jesus were baptized into His death? v.4 Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Acts 22:16 And now, why are you waiting? Arise and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Romans 10:9-10 That if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. v.10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Jesus also said that if we confess Him before men, He will confess us before His Father in heaven. It is most important that we believe Jesus is who He claims to be, the I AM Who spoke to Moses out of the burning bush, the God of Abraham; then to call upon Him speaking to Him in our hearts, and to confess Him as our Savior and Lord God before men.

#9
GoldenEagle

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Baptism is an outward expression of an inward faith. It is something a christian should do in obedience to Christ. I think if someone is a true born again Bible believing Christian they will desire to be baptized. I do not believe that baptism is necessary for salvation because that would take away from the cross.

Ephesians 2:8-9 NKJV

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.

I would just like to add one last thing. If water baptism was a necessity for salvation, that is, it was required to be saved, then Jesus would have been made a liar when he told the thief on the cross next to him that he would be in heaven. Am I missing the mark on this?

 

Amen! We are dead to sin and alive to God! Baptism is a picture of this. Reminds me of Romans 6 and in particular the verses below. :thumbsup:


Rom. 6:3-14
 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

 

For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. We know that our old self[was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. For one who has died has been set freefrom sin. Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10 For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11 So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

 

12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13 Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

God bless,

GE



#10
Osterloh

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Surely, there are 4 different Christian baptisms in the NT.

Some say more than 4 ... but I see only 3 major ones and 1 intermediate one.



#11
GoldenEagle

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Surely, there are 4 different Christian baptisms in the NT.

Some say more than 4 ... but I see only 3 major ones and 1 intermediate one.

 

I've always understood there to be one baptism. Please explain? What passages are you reffering to?

For example:

Eph. 4:4-5

There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call— one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

God bless,

GE



#12
Osterloh

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Surely, there are 4 different Christian baptisms in the NT.

Some say more than 4 ... but I see only 3 major ones and 1 intermediate one.

 

I've always understood there to be one baptism. Please explain? What passages are you reffering to?

For example:
Eph. 4:4-5

There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call—

one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

 

Yes, I've heard it explained that the above refers to one Christian water baptism.

Here's a better one ...

Hebrews 6:

1   Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection,

not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 

2   of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.


Edited by Osterloh, 26 July 2014 - 10:15 AM.


#13
OneLight

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Surely, there are 4 different Christian baptisms in the NT.

Some say more than 4 ... but I see only 3 major ones and 1 intermediate one.

 

I've always understood there to be one baptism. Please explain? What passages are you reffering to?

For example:
Eph. 4:4-5

There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call—

one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

 

Yes, I've heard it explained that the above refers to one Christian water baptism.

Here's a better one ...

Hebrews 6:

1   Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection,

not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 

2   of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

 

 

Keep in mind who the writer is writing to, the Hebrew people.  They had more than one baptisms, or cleansing.



#14
Osterloh

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Hebrews 6:

1   Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection,

not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 

2   of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

 

Keep in mind who the writer is writing to, the Hebrew people.  They had more than one baptisms, or cleansing.

 

Yes, but there ARE multiple baptisms in the NT.

An example of one other than water baptism is ...

“For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body (the church)

… and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. For in fact

the body is not one member but many.” (1 Corinthians 12:12-14).



#15
OneLight

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Hebrews 6:
1   Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection,
not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 
2   of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

 
Keep in mind who the writer is writing to, the Hebrew people.  They had more than one baptisms, or cleansing.

 
Yes, but there ARE multiple baptisms in the NT.
An example of one other than water baptism is ...
“For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body (the church)
… and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. For in fact
the body is not one member but many.” (1 Corinthians 12:12-14).


How does what you state line up with what GoldenEagle provided from Ephesians 4:4-6?

There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call—one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.


There is an outward action for a new inner commitment, water baptism, and there is the one baptism, through the Holy Spirit into Christ.

Are you aware of the many ritual baptisms, or cleansing, the Hebrew people undertook?

#16
Ozzy

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Hi Gigman!

 

Baptism serves multiple purposes and most of the people on this thread have shown the scriptures for them. The first and most obvious of these purposes is to be washed in a symbolical manner to take away your sins. The next reason, which others term "outward sign of an inward change", is really where a person who has gained faith in Jesus Christ and repented of their sins enters into a covenant with God to take upon them the name of Jesus Christ and become disciples in the kingdom of God. They promise to follow Jesus, always remember Him, and keep His commandments. In return, they are promised the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

 

I think many people want to debate whether it be a commandment or not, in other words, MUST one be baptized? We can look at a few selections and determine the answer. First, Jesus, obviously a sinless being, went to John the Baptist for His baptism. John doesn't;'t really want to baptism, knowing Jesus is holy and does not need baptism to wash away sins, but Jesus insists on doing it. Some may correctly argue that Jesus wanted to set an example for us, but there is more to it. Jesus says to John, "Suffer it to be so now; for thus it becometh us to fulfill all righteousness." (Matt 3:15 KJV) Can we say that we can fulfill righteousness if we don't want to follow our Lord and Savior into the waters of baptism? Jesus had to do it to keep the commandment of His Father and so must we. Other posts in this thread have clearly shown that the apostles when asked what should men do to follow Jesus, they constantly demanded repentance and baptism.

 

A couple of things on the symbolism of baptism. 1) Baptism by immersion is symbolic of the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. As we repent and enter into the waters of baptism, our old sinful self is being put to death, being buried, and then brought up out of the water into a new life, a life of being a disciple of Christ. (2) The whole commandment to be accept Christ's atonement, be baptized, and receive the Holy Spirit is symbolic of being born again. As a baby is born physically of water, blood, and spirit - we too are born again. We are washed in water, cleansed by the blood of Christ, and by the Holy Spirit.

 

Also, some think that the thief on the cross is a great reason to excuse people from following the commandment. They fail to realize that the thief nor Jesus went directly to heaven, or at least where God the Father dwells. They went to a place termed "paradise". It is easy to see how some may equate paradise with heaven, but as we look at some examples we will see that it is not. First, Jesus dies, He is gone 3 days, then He returns as a resurrected being and tells Mary not to touch Him because He had not yet gone to the Father. If He did not go to the Father, or heaven, then where was He? 1 Peter 3:19-20 talk about Christ preaching to the spirits in prison, those who had been washed away in the flood of Noah. Apparently they had been in a spiritual prison all this time. (Isaiah 24:22) We have two terms here, prison and paradise, both of which do not seem to denote heaven, or where God dwells. To say the thief enjoyed repentance and forgiveness by merely asking Jesus to go with Him is incorrect. But the thief went to this spirit realm where Jesus then taught them and offered them the way to God.



#17
just_fish

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You do not need to be baptised to be saved - the dying thief is ample testimony to that! However, if one is saved and one has the opportunity to be baptised it is unthinkable that such a person would refuse. Clearly Jesus Christ commands baptism, and clearly he also says,  John 14:15 "If you love Me, keep My commandments." to profess conversion but to refuse baptism is to say to Jesus, "I don't really love you enough to do the things that I know will please you!"

 

Hi RB--

   I do agree with your post, as well as most of the thoughts on this thread. I however have run across people whom were Baptised as infants, later in life coming to Christ. They truely struggle with the thought of being "re-baptised". It seems more of an indoctrinal thought process from their youth and teaching growing up.

 

  The young Brother in Christ whom I am currently mentouring is struggling with this as well, he feels it's wrong to be Baptised again since Scripture states "one Baptism". I think we just need to keep this in mind.

 

   Any thoughts?

 

 

Thank You

 

JF



#18
jmlusa2000

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Baptism is not necessary for salvation. Requiring anything other than faith in Jesus would be a works based salvation. Adding to the gospel would be saying that Jesus' death on the cross is not sufficient for our salvation.

Baptism shows that a born again Christian believes in Christ's death, burial, and ressurection.

 

Romans 6:3-4 states, “Or don't you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.” The action of being immersed in the water illustrates dying and being buried with Christ. The action of coming out of the water illustrates Christ’s resurrection.
 
Baptism is a symbol of what has occured in the heart and life of a person who has faith in Jesus Christ.
as savior. "Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ", (1 Peter 3:21). Peter tought that baptism is not a symbol of salvation, but a "pledge" of good conscience toward God.


#19
Guest_Jesse_*

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Baptism of water is just a symbol of the real thing,which is the babptism of the holy Spirit.

This ;only Jesus can do. Not everyone can be baptised with the Holy Spirit.

We start with water,to enter into God's business.Then we practice; get better,and improve.

Then christ will baptise with the HS. Knowledge will come a measure at a time.



#20
GoldenEagle

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You do not need to be baptised to be saved - the dying thief is ample testimony to that! However, if one is saved and one has the opportunity to be baptised it is unthinkable that such a person would refuse. Clearly Jesus Christ commands baptism, and clearly he also says,  John 14:15 "If you love Me, keep My commandments." to profess conversion but to refuse baptism is to say to Jesus, "I don't really love you enough to do the things that I know will please you!"

 

Hi RB--

   I do agree with your post, as well as most of the thoughts on this thread. I however have run across people whom were Baptised as infants, later in life coming to Christ. They truely struggle with the thought of being "re-baptised". It seems more of an indoctrinal thought process from their youth and teaching growing up.

 

  The young Brother in Christ whom I am currently mentouring is struggling with this as well, he feels it's wrong to be Baptised again since Scripture states "one Baptism". I think we just need to keep this in mind.

 

   Any thoughts?

 

 

Thank You

 

JF

 

Hey JF, baptism should always come AFTER belief in Jesus if we were to follow Scripture. Being baptized as a child/infant is the same in my view as a dedication of a local church to teach the child the ways of God in the BIble. Just a few thoughts. Hope this helps.

God bless, 

GE






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